The Cart Barn Podcast

Stewart Cink (00:00)
Record the audio and hear anything. Sometimes they ask us to do the phone recording thing in case there's a mess up. There shouldn't be. I've had some podcasters like me to do a voice memo of the whole thing. So if there's any mess ups, nah, okay. Shouldn't be, I'm at home. We're all solid wifi here.

J Chris Lemley (00:06)
Say what now?

Yeah, I think we're good.

All right. Well, we'll just do this a little quick, but kind of go over and do some talk about the master stuff. I've even got my master's t-shirt on. We're ready to go. Yeah.

Stewart Cink (00:27)
I saw that, saw that.

That's 75 bucks well spent right there.

J Chris Lemley (00:31)
Yeah.

All right. Well, welcome back to the Cart Barn podcast. Today we have Stewart Cink rejoining the podcast. We're always happy to have Stewart and I'm going to talk about Masters Week. Stewart, welcome to the Cart Barn.

Stewart Cink (00:48)
Appreciate it. Good to be with you guys as always.

Gregg Dewalt (00:51)
Third time.

Stewart Cink (00:53)
Third time.

Gregg Dewalt (00:55)
You're the most visited guest on our podcast.

Stewart Cink (00:58)
Is there a maximum that am I gonna get like asked to not reappear until a certain date?

J Chris Lemley (00:59)
Yeah. No, not at all. Not at all.

No.

Gregg Dewalt (01:05)
No,

we just decide who can we get this week that'll be accommodating and you've been accommodating.

Stewart Cink (01:11)
Yeah,

J Chris Lemley (01:12)
Ha

Stewart Cink (01:13)
who's unemployed for most of the week when they're not playing in a golf tournament? That's Stewart Cink.

J Chris Lemley (01:17)
Hahaha

Gregg Dewalt (01:17)
That is.

So how are things Stewart?

Stewart Cink (01:20)
Everything's good, real good.

Gregg Dewalt (01:22)
How's your golf game?

Stewart Cink (01:24)
It's been pretty good. This year's been, haven't quite put it all together for a tournament, but I've knocked at the door a couple of times and, you know, I'm having fun playing. So that's a big part of it.

J Chris Lemley (01:37)
Yeah, watching you on TV swing looks good. Hey, I've got an equipment question for you so you had it seems like at one point you had a seven wood in the bag and It looked like the other day that you had replaced the seven wood for a hybrid is that did I see that correctly?

Stewart Cink (01:41)
Sure, what you got?

You're right.

No, you are quite observant. I did do that. Although it was about 20, 23. So it's been a year and a half or so, but yeah, the seven what I had, you know, I played long irons for a long time, like two iron and a one iron even. And when players were starting to go to the more lofted hybrids, I really never connected with the hybrids that well. And so,

J Chris Lemley (02:04)
OK.

Stewart Cink (02:23)
I stayed with the long irons, but I just got so tired of being in the rough and having no shot to a green on a par five because I couldn't get my long iron on the ball and I couldn't get anything on it. And so, um, at first I tried a five wood and the results out of the rough were good, but it was hitting it too far, like a little too close to my three wood. And so, uh, the ping guys were just like, this is kind of a no brainer. If you tried a seven wood and, I always thought that was for either sissies or my mom, maybe.

Nothing personal mom. You're not a sissy But I do know that my mom has a whole golf bag full of head covers now except for a putter. So Maybe I'm going that direction, but no, I'd say back around 2017 I switched to the sevenwood and I use it for a long time. It was really really good. But then As the new clubs came out the new models ping put out the one I used was a 400

J Chris Lemley (02:56)
Ugh, it's staying.

Stewart Cink (03:22)
And then the 410 came out and in the 425, you know, the models they sequentially take over and they kept going a little higher and every model was a little higher and a little higher. And so the most recent seven would the G430 that came in about 22 or 23 anyway, getting in the weeds here, but it was a little too high for a seven would even for me, it was just too much launch and just too much spin. And so

What happens is with those lofted fairways is if you hit it in the middle of the face, you get like really nice ball flight and the spin rate is right where it ought to be. But anywhere on the bottom of the face or on the heel or on the toe even, the spin goes really like through the roof and it costs you a lot of distance. And so I was seeing a lot of disparity between my solid shots and my miss hits. Enough so where, you know, if I hit a really good solid shot, it was gonna hit the green. And if I hit it thin, it was gonna come up like 10 yards short of the green. Well, that's not good.

on a hole where you're trying to carry it over something and get it to the front of the green. And so I talked to Spencer, who's my main guy over at Ping, and just said, look, I want a club that goes exactly as far as this one does, but I want it to go a little lower and I want it to go with a little bit less spin. And he goes, easy. And the next day a box showed up. I was at Pebble Beach. A box showed up and it had a hybrid in it. And it was one of their hybrids and the shaft he had measured out according to swing weight and all that stuff. And

I hit like five shots on the range and it did exactly what I asked. It was the exact carry, 245. It flew about 12 feet lower overall height and it had about 800 to a thousand RPMs less spin. So it did exactly the same thing that the other club was doing, that the seven was doing distance wise, but it got there with a lot more efficiency and I don't need a lot of height. It's already hit the ball pretty high. So it brought that ball down in the miss hits were just so much more under control and

I switched to the hybrid of that tournament and I haven't switched back since. That was the fall of 23.

That is your question. I feel like I just like open up the fire hydrant with techno stuff there

J Chris Lemley (05:22)
Wow, that's, no, that was awesome. Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (05:26)
What's

the loft on that hybrid?

Stewart Cink (05:30)
Well, in the time since that was a four hybrid and I have since switched to a three just because Again, just trying to get that a little bit lower and a little bit more a little bit less spin But still the same distance and I want to say the loft is about 19 or 20 degrees I don't really know for sure. don't know. I I put it in on the I think my three hybrids on the little on the plus so I Crank it slightly more lofted Because it's adjustable and then the four hybrid I used either in the

all the way shut down or one short of being all the way shut down. So you can kind of create the same loft with different heads and then you have a couple different options for you a condition might come up where it's either really windy or the ground's really hard or soft or something. So I got a couple good options that I can just plug and play within the set. Yeah and there's another since we're already like so far down the road with this there's more too. The clubface on the hybrid

J Chris Lemley (06:19)
That's pretty cool. Thanks for answering that.

Gregg Dewalt (06:22)
So

what do you?

Stewart Cink (06:30)
has grooves all the way across the face. And the club face on the seven wood, the grooves stop right around the sweet spot and there's a little section where there's no groove. So if you hit a good shot, you're hitting the ball on a part of the face with no grooves. Well, I like the grooves because when you're hitting the shot out of the rough or if it's wet, you want the grooves to do their job and that is to take moisture and grass and debris between the club and the ball.

Disperse it into the grooves and sort of channel it out to the side. It all happens in like a microsecond, but that's what you want and so you get Consistent spin even when the conditions aren't that good like if it's raining or it's in the morning and it's dewy or you're in wet rough You're gonna get consistent spin and you can count on that ball to have a little softer flight as opposed to sometimes with the 7-wood you get this screamer that's like my gosh, where's that gonna go? It's just like got no spin and it's like a flyer so

That's another solution that the hybrid provides for me over the 7-Way.

Gregg Dewalt (07:29)
You've spent a lot of time, obviously, on this topic, studying it.

J Chris Lemley (07:35)
Hahaha

Stewart Cink (07:36)
I

detect a little, let's move on in your tone there, Greg. Yeah, I know I'm pretty nerdy about this stuff, but I have to be, you know, I mean, I enjoy that part of the job and it's just, I feel like it's a responsibility I have when I'm, trying to be the best player I can be. And so I don't want to step on the golf course with any doubts. And you always have doubts at least to a certain extent about your golf game. Like what can I do or what am I going to mess up today?

J Chris Lemley (07:39)
No, no, no, that's... I like it.

Gregg Dewalt (07:39)
No, my next question

Stewart Cink (08:04)
But you don't want to ever walk on the course with your equipment being in one of those doubts because you have every bit of control over that. And so I choose to eliminate that as a source of any kind of doubt. And I'll just keep the doubts inside here.

J Chris Lemley (08:18)
So you've

got a 3 and a 4?

Stewart Cink (08:20)
I got a three and a four. I don't use them both, but I have a three and a four that I use either or. Because they go the same distance, just they get there slightly in different ways.

J Chris Lemley (08:28)
chef links the same.

Stewart Cink (08:29)
The shaft lengths are almost the same. They're like a quarter of an inch different. the Ping guys made the club head weights about the same where they could be interchanged with the shaft.

J Chris Lemley (08:39)
Okay.

Gregg Dewalt (08:40)
Not that you ever do this but is the five iron your punch out club?

Stewart Cink (08:45)
I I've punched out with every club including my putter. I remember putting when I was up, I had to ramp one off a cart path and I had no other play and I've chipped out with my putter. I don't know if I've chipped out with a driver, but I think I've used every other club to chip out.

J Chris Lemley (08:56)
you

What's your... What's your... Chip out, Greg.

Gregg Dewalt (09:03)
Not that you do it very often.

Stewart Cink (09:05)
When you hit the trees as much as I do,

get very accustomed to the chip out and very versatile.

Gregg Dewalt (09:10)
All right, we're going to jump into the masters here. Your first one was... I think I've seen you chip out at the masters, but I'm not positive.

J Chris Lemley (09:15)
Yes,

Yeah

Stewart Cink (09:24)
I'm sure you have.

J Chris Lemley (09:25)
and play.

Stewart Cink (09:25)
If you've watched me play golf at Augusta National, you've seen me chip out.

J Chris Lemley (09:28)
Well, how many, how many masters have you played? think Greg said he'd counted 19, 20.

Stewart Cink (09:33)
I believe it's 20. I'd have to go back and

count exactly. But I think in 22, there was some comments made that, wow, you're 20th master. That's cool. So I think it's been 20.

J Chris Lemley (09:44)
Nice.

Gregg Dewalt (09:47)
Your first one is probably one of the most memorable simply because Reagan was born ahead of the actual first shot.

Stewart Cink (09:58)
Yeah, that was definitely your first Masters is very memorable for a lot of reasons, but that one was even made more memorable because he was born my second son Reagan when he was born Tuesday of my first Masters in on April 8th, 1997. So every year during the Masters, we always celebrate his birthday and and so he was born on Tuesday in 1997 and then in 2022 on Friday, he was caddying for me on his 25th birthday when he made it.

I made a hole in one on 16. So that was pretty good ways to book in his first 25 years with Augusta.

J Chris Lemley (10:28)
Mm-hmm.

Gregg Dewalt (10:33)
And then you promptly fired him a little later, right? From the bag.

Stewart Cink (10:37)
Yeah, yeah, it just wasn't working out. No, my gosh, that was the best. And having him caddy for two years and especially Augusta, especially, know, Augusta and I would say, you know, he caddied for me also at St. Andrew's, which is my favorite course in the world for the 22 Open Championship, which was the 150th. And that was just spectacular too.

J Chris Lemley (10:49)
here.

Stewart Cink (11:06)
But no, having him caddy was awesome. if it was a vacuum that we all lived in, I think he would still be caddying. But, because he loved it. you know, life kind of calls. And it was not really something I wanted my son to do forever. But this sure was fun while it lasted.

Gregg Dewalt (11:24)
Yeah, absolutely. So take us back to 97. Obviously it was a little bit hectic with Lisa was due. I think I remember, I think you told me if he comes later in the week, I'm not playing. And it worked out, but it was kind of a ordeal.

Stewart Cink (11:44)
Yeah, it was. it was, I think I remember also that was my mindset. Like, okay, you know, the due date is, I think if I remember right, the due date was like Friday or maybe the next Monday. I don't know, but it was right around where it could happen anytime. And, and, I pretty much told Lisa and we decided together that like, yeah, you know, if, if he decides to come, you know, during the first couple of days of the masters, then I'm just gonna withdraw.

I mean, I didn't think that was going to be my last Masters, but I just didn't really care. just didn't want to not be there for that. I remember being over there on Monday, I was playing a practice round and I was on the fourth tee. This was before Masters had put in there no cell phone policy because almost nobody had a cell phone. I remember I had a phone, it one of those where you lift the antenna up and you hit send to talk and it's crackly and everything.

J Chris Lemley (12:41)
Mm-hmm.

Stewart Cink (12:43)
So I remember my phone ringing in my bag on number 4T. I was playing with Willie Wood and got the phone out, raised the antenna, hit send, hello. And it's Lisa, she was at the doctor's office. She's like, well, he says that it's time to induce now. it's, or I think she said, I'm ready to induce, so come on home and I think we're gonna have a baby tomorrow. So I did that. Went home and Reagan was born on Tuesday and I...

I came back over on probably the next day on Wednesday and so did Lisa. So, Reagan didn't even spend his first night at home. He's been at Augusta. Parents of the year right there, you know, like take your child from the hospital. mean, the umbilical cord was barely even cut and we're in the car. He's, I was already there and Lisa took him on over, but we had all of our family there. You know, my parents and her parents, first masters and Reagan being born, all everybody was there. So, it was just simple or just a.

J Chris Lemley (13:22)
Wow.

Stewart Cink (13:42)
take him over there for a two hour drive and set him up in the rental house for his first couple nights.

Gregg Dewalt (13:48)
So just a quick aside, of course, I mean, you're going to your first Masters, first kid from Florence, this part of the state to go to the play in the Masters. I'm going over there to cover you. And all of a sudden, I don't know if you're going to be playing. there's a backstory to how hard it was for me to even get credentials for the first Masters. And I'm thinking Monday night, it's like, I'm not going to have a tournament to cover. They're going to make me go home.

Stewart Cink (14:01)
You

J Chris Lemley (14:15)
I'm

sorry.

Stewart Cink (14:17)
You could have covered Tiger Woods you'd have been you covered him anyway, come on don't lie

J Chris Lemley (14:21)
Thank

Gregg Dewalt (14:21)
I, yeah, I did a little bit. It was historic.

Stewart Cink (14:25)
It was, it was a big Masters. mean, for our family, obviously, for the reasons we just discussed, but then the whole Tiger Woods thing and the way he just burst onto the scene and, you know, Jim Nantz saying, let the record show, was it 5.04 PM, Tiger Woods took the lead at the Masters for the first time. And, um, yeah, it was a big one. Um, certainly one that a lot of people point back to is their, um, earliest memory.

J Chris Lemley (14:27)
That was...

Mm-hmm.

Gregg Dewalt (14:50)
You had played Augusta before, you know, you just didn't show up a tournament week in college. You'd you'd gone down there and Georgia Tech had gone down there and played some, right?

Stewart Cink (15:00)
Yeah, we played, we played it, we got invited to play every year. We got rained out my first time. So I think I had played it three and maybe one other time with a friend who's a member. So I had played it a couple of times and not in a way of like getting ready for the masters. But I might've gone over there, you know, from where I lived at the time, it was only about two and a half hours. So I could get there and play a practice round in a day and come back.

J Chris Lemley (15:27)
Yeah.

Stewart Cink (15:27)
real easy.

So I may have done that a few times before too. Didn't matter. was nowhere near ready to play that golf course once the tournament started.

Gregg Dewalt (15:31)
What was the

J Chris Lemley (15:32)
Thank

Well, yeah, what's the yeah, can imagine what's tell us share a little bit about the first time you drive in down Magnolia lane on on, you know, going to play in in the Masters. That's that's not a a field that most people listening to the podcast are ever going to experience. Tell us a little bit about that.

Stewart Cink (15:56)
Yeah, it's

a rare feeling and certainly it occurs to you when you pull in anytime driving down through the gate that if you're in the Masters and you're driving down there for the first time as a Masters participant, it's like, wow, this is kind of like the pinnacle of professional golf. Like, this is awesome. And I remember getting that feeling for sure. And I still, got it every time I went through the gate, every time I played there.

Part of it is, you you see the trees and you can kind of get a glimpse of the clubhouse down about 500 yards straight ahead. And part of it is the gate staff, the guards are kind of like, they let you know for sure that you're like kind of on borrowed time there. I mean, they're nice guys, but there's no question that you're a guest and not like you don't belong there. you know, and I'm usually driving through with my, car, not masters official tournament vehicle. So.

J Chris Lemley (16:39)
Hahaha

Stewart Cink (16:53)
They're usually like double checking my ID a little bit more and there's you stop at the gate and they know after a couple of times they know who you are and they're like Mr. Singh they wave you right through and then there's another stop about another hundred yards up where they scan your barcode on your badge and anybody in the car they roll all the windows down and anybody in the car you get scanned because they don't want anybody you know being snuck in That's how much they trust us. They have a second gate that we have to go through But now that's just a part of the deal. I mean, they're very you know

They control very heavily the gates at all entry points and for good reason. mean, it's a sought after ticket and coming in through Magnolia Lane and right down to the clubhouse and you kind of work your way around the front of the clubhouse and then back up to the beside the driving range to where our parking lot is and kind of start your day from there. The caddies they built about 10 years ago, they built a new basically a clubhouse that serves the caddies only and it's just to the right of the practice area. So when you park your car,

you're almost in the front door of the caddy. They call it the caddy house or the caddy HQ or whatever, but it's basically like a clubhouse and inside the caddy area, they have a lounge with dining. They have like a short order window where you can just order off the menu or they have like a little buffet set up. They have lockers for every caddy. They have a lounging space that are private. So you can like have a meeting with your caddy and your player and team all in one place and kind of

get behind closed doors, they have TV set up. They have all the Masters concession items in a big fridge. You can just open up and grab as many as you want and take them home with you. Egg salad for me, thank you very little. And so they also have maybe the best sweet tea I've ever tasted in my life. And what else do have? mean, they have access to club repair right there. There's a person staffing anything you need, club repair. And this is not just at the Masters, this is all the time.

During the Masters of course the equipment trucks are Right across the street not on site, but they are parked right across the street so can easily get in and out But if you need something's grips or loft and lie down or whatever There's a there's all that's available They have all the launch monitors available for you if you don't have your own everybody in the Masters already has one but they have it available and Then gosh, there's about nine different kinds of range balls. You can choose from all

Basically every ball that's played by a competitor in that year's tournament is available just in heaps in bags for you to grab. It's a good place to do ball testing if you're interested. then, gosh, mean, the facility itself where you actually just do your hitting is so well thought out. It's got a couple of different angles for driving with fairways cut that are about the same width as the fairways. It's got an almost exact replica to scale of number two green for your wedge shots.

so you can hit all the different shots into number two green right there. And it's got three magnificent short game areas with all kinds of variety and the bunkers and you know, there's no rough at the golf course, but all the tightly mown areas with different kind of grain around the greens. They didn't leave one thing, you know, to chance. It's just all so perfectly dialed and it's cool. It's a cool place to practice and it really makes you want to work on your game.

J Chris Lemley (20:08)
Yeah. So would you say that's the, is that the best practice facility on tour?

Stewart Cink (20:13)
Yeah, it's right up there. mean, guess TPC Sawgrass is maybe a little bit larger and more, you know, you can, at Sawgrass, the great thing about it is you can jump back to the back of the range and it's reserved for tour players only. So you never have anybody coming up to you. There's no spectators back there. It's a lot of variety too and plenty of area, but as far as what's available to you, the one at Augusta National is, it's just impossible to surpass it because it has everything.

J Chris Lemley (20:43)
Yeah. Cool.

Gregg Dewalt (20:45)
So

I think you and I had talked the first tee shot at Augusta. How nerve wracking is it and how does it kind of set up your round?

Stewart Cink (20:59)
Well, yeah, first of all, it's probably the hardest hole in the golf course. think if you look statistically, one and 11 almost always, depending on the wind direction for the year, flip flop for number one and two. So you're not just talking about like a little, like I think, was it Fazio that said you want to start the day off with a handshake? Augusta National slaps you. It doesn't give you a handshake. Number one is the most treacherous green. It's raised up around. And so if you miss off to the side, your ball's going to roll off.

and it's really steep back and front and then the fairway it's about 60 yards wide if you leave it short of the bunker. So not that hard to hit that fairway if you want a five or six time to the green. If you want to get less than that you got to take it up into the bunker and then the fairway gets cut in half and it's about 30-35 yards wide and it is actually for the length of the shot I was just looking at my yardage book because I'm going to share some notes with the kid.

Hiroshi Tai who played, who plays for Georgia Tech and he won the NCAAs last year so he's in the Masters next week. So he and I are gonna sit down and have a little powwow about some of the stuff. I'm gonna share some of my notes. And I just looking at that first hole and I have down that your ideal carry to take distance off the hole but also stay kind of in the widest part of the fairway where it's reasonable is between 270 and 287. So most of the time that's either a driver or three wood. In fact about

95 % of the time there are occasions where it's less if it's straight down wind but that'd be an unusual win for Augusta National so a 270 to 287 is what you're looking at to carry the ball and that'll give you probably like around 160 to the hole and It takes a pretty good drive to hit the fairway if you don't you're either in the bunker You can be right at the bunker right at the bunkers trees. That's no good That's chip out you can use any club in your bag from over there and then to the left unless the trees blew down in the storm

a couple of, or last fall, then the left trees are just not very good. They're just spaced together pretty tightly and you don't have very many options from over there. it is quite a demanding drive on top of the nerves, on top of the nerves. It's, it's a, it's one of the most difficult drives on the golf course and then it only gets harder at the green.

Gregg Dewalt (23:15)
How much is it lengthened since between 97 and your last appearance in 22? Because I think there was a time when people were basically could carry the bunker.

Stewart Cink (23:27)
Yeah,

there were. And, um, I'd have to go back and look exactly, but, um, it's about three 30 to get over the bunker now. And that plays uphill about, you know, five, six yards. So there's not too many players can carry over three 35. There's just, I don't know. Everybody thinks we all carry it at three 30, but come on. That's reserved for like, I mean, maybe Bryson and Rory, if it's a little bit downwind, you can carry it that far. There's really not other guys carrying it that far. But I remember when they linked the number one,

The bunker stayed the same. And we got there and you know, the putting green is right beside number one T. So it's only like a 20 yard walk from the edge of the putting green over to the T and we all heard that they had lengthened it. And this was probably 10 years ago, maybe 15. And we got there and we're on the T like, I thought they took T back. You know, that's exactly where it was. The T's not any different. Well, they moved the whole putting green back.

30 yards too and recreated it exactly like it was like to the tenth of an inch with the laser and you couldn't tell the difference. The only way you could tell was if you look from the tee straight to the right, you were looking at a different part of the clubhouse than you used to look at. That was 30 yards further up there. Otherwise you could not tell. There was no difference in the relationship between any of the area right around the first tee. It looked exactly the same. That's the way they do all their changes. The most astonishing was number five when they changed out about

five years ago, they made that hole just ridiculously long, but they didn't change the tee shot. They moved the tee back 40 yards, but they also moved the fairway bunkers and the trees and everything back. So you're hitting the exact same shot off the tee to the yardage book even looks the same. It's just that the second shot, now everything's 40 yards back closer to you. So you've got 40 yards added to your second shot. And they did that without changing the look of the hole. Except that when you walk off four green, instead of just being right on the tee.

J Chris Lemley (25:17)
Mm-hmm.

Stewart Cink (25:23)
you're like, oh, now I got to walk way back there to the tee. But then the whole looks exactly the same. just have this way of, well, it takes a lot of resources and, but a lot of vision and planning too, but they, they use their vision and planning and their resources to a really high degree and very successful.

J Chris Lemley (25:32)
Yeah.

What's your favorite hole at Augusta?

Stewart Cink (25:43)
I've always thought number three was the best hole. I mean, it's just a it might be getting a little bit Outdated not it not outdated is not the right word There's nothing wrong with the hole, but it used to be where you had a choice You can either lay up or hit a driver. There's a big cluster of bunkers down the left side. It's about 280 to carry those and If you got up really close to the green you had you if you got it over those bunkers You had a wide fairway and you could be hitting kind of like up into the green angle a little bit But it was an awkward distance

like 70 yards, 60 yards, kind of going off of an uneven lie to an uphill green. was a little awkward. So you had to decide like, which one do I want? Do I want the second shot from up there or do I want to be back here? But nowadays pretty much everybody hits driver on that hole. the last three Masters I played and I hit driver every day on that hole. And I played it better than I used to. So the way to play it now, I think everybody's figured out.

is to hit a driver and get it up there close because even if your wedge shot's awkward, you're still gonna hit, but well, like your really good shots from 70 yards are gonna be better than your really good shots from 125. And your bad shots from 70 are also gonna be a lot better. it's just, even if it feels awkward, it's still statistically the way to play it. And there's not a single player in the Masters doesn't know that. And so everybody's just gonna ship it off that tee now and hit it as far down there they can and hit it to the left and hit up the green. And you'll see guys hitting chip shots that, you

J Chris Lemley (26:49)
Mm, sure.

Stewart Cink (27:09)
20 yards shorter than green you'll even see some guys if it's somewhat firm Roll it onto the upslope going up the front of the green. It's about 360 if they have a little bit of help so That's just the way to play the hole nowadays, but it's still an awesome hole because the green is so terrifying and Shallow and if you miss it, you're just in for a nightmare And you know that no matter where your ball sitting in there on your tee shot, you know that

J Chris Lemley (27:30)
Yeah.

Which I won't I won't say which hole is your least which hole sits does not set up the best for you

Stewart Cink (27:42)
None of them set up good for me. And that's

what makes the course so great is that really there's no comfortable shots. It always leaves you feeling uncomfortable because there's disaster. I mean, probably the most uncomfortable shot on the course to me has always been the second shot on 11 because the pond's right there. Everybody knows the pond is just staring you in face. You you're going downhill. You can see the entire green in the pond just staring at you. But to the right,

J Chris Lemley (27:49)
Yeah.

Stewart Cink (28:10)
is so terrible and so you cannot bail right. They've done a great job there too just kind of subtly lowering the right side of the green there where actually not the green but it used to be you remember Larry Meiss chipping in some of your older some of your older viewers and listeners might remember when Larry Meiss chipped in he hit that long bump and run that bounced a couple times before it went on the green right it just skidded across the fairway and ended up on the green rolling well

J Chris Lemley (28:25)
Mm-hmm, sure.

Stewart Cink (28:40)
That was nice and flat. Now, if you go over there, you try that shot, you're coming up about a six foot bank that looks like this steep because they've sculpted that right side out. So if you, if you bail, your ball is going to hit that slope and go not only to the right, but also down back towards 12 and give you just as impossible third shot. So the days of Larry Mize's little bump and run through the fairway are gone. They're gone. And it makes the second shot so hard. the whole is about five, I don't know.

J Chris Lemley (28:57)
Mm-hmm.

They're gone.

Stewart Cink (29:10)
515 plays downhill, you know, so that it takes care of some of the yardage, but dang It's just long and that second shot is really hard. It's hard for everybody. It's not just me

Gregg Dewalt (29:22)
What are you coming into that green with normally?

Stewart Cink (29:25)
As little as like a seven or eight if it's dry and as much as a four or even hybrid But I mean if you're coming in there with a hybrid you're not trying to hit it on the green you're you're it's windy It's wet. You might have mud on your ball. Actually, they don't say mud on the ball If you notice it, there's never mud on the ball in the telecast never So but it does happen But yeah

can be really long. I remember having 240 into the hole there when that pins in the back. I mean, it's downhill, you know, about 10 or 12 yards, but 240 to that target. I mean, it's just like bailout city and you cannot bail out. There's nowhere to go except short of the green. It's just a, it's a frightening hole and all the majors, I'd have put it right up there with the road hole at 17 St. Andrews and that one. And the tee shot at 12 can be scary too, if it's windy out of Augusta.

But the fear factor is just through the roof right there.

Gregg Dewalt (30:29)
What when 18 is another hole I mean that shoot off the tee is it seems like it's become so narrow because they've moved the tee bag.

Stewart Cink (30:40)
Yeah, it is narrow, but you know that when you ask players what shots are right and you that shoot doesn't come up on the list very often because most of us, most of us can start the ball on a pretty reasonable line. It may not finish on the line. We want it, but you're, really not going to start it offline by that much that often. So occasionally you'll hit that side of that shoot. If you're trying to like work a cut up the fairway.

And I've hit the shoot, you know, I've, I've hit the side of it and ended up down there in the bottom. I've seen other players do it, but that's not the shot that's in your mind when you think like, boy, you know, deep breath. got a handle of that's the national day. It's not that shot. It's definitely second shot on 11, first shot on one. the second shot on five, those are the holes that are just like, those are in your mind, kind of similar to the way the Island green is on sawgrass. When you know, like you're playing 13 and 14, you're already thinking about it.

or even Phoenix with the big crowd on 16, as soon as you make the turn, you're thinking about 16. That kind of pops into your mind on the second shot on 11s in your mind earlier.

Gregg Dewalt (31:49)
Five green five to me was always looked like a super tough hole just the greenest diabolical

Stewart Cink (31:57)
Yeah, the

green on five is not made for a long shot coming in. It just repels the golf balls and because the slope in the front is such a steep slope, the second half of the green repels balls away towards the back and you're coming in there between 185 and 215 now that the hole has been lengthened the way we described earlier. And it's just not made for a shot that long and it's probably not the greatest hole.

at the golf course anymore because it's just not a very good fit for a long second shot, but it creates a lot of short game interest because you get a huge variety of different kinds of shots running green. The back bunker is an option. It's not the worst bunker to be in at the golf course. it's just a lot of, probably some of the fewest greens in regulation on that hole. And so therefore you see a lot of different kinds of chips and with the slope on the green, you can be real creative at different kinds of shots.

J Chris Lemley (32:36)
Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (32:55)
What, uh, you know, just kind of keeping the same vein, you know, seven has become a little more difficult with the, with the lengthening of it. Uh, you really can't run the ball up out of the trees. Can you.

Stewart Cink (33:10)
No, you never could run it up out of the trees, but the used to back when when I first started playing the Masters, I want to say the hole was about 375 and now it's 455. So if you hit it the trees before you had a real short shot and you could do something with the ball. Now you probably couldn't hit it on the green, but you could control where you hit it in the front bunker. You could give yourself an upslope or an angle or something. Now if you hit it trees, you know you you got a lot further in and

a lot more trees to go through too. And it's all uphill the second shot. So it's the narrowest tee ball on the course because the fairway itself is narrow and then the trees are also right beside the fairway. So it's easy to get tree trouble. Fairway slopes to the right and that green again, kind of like we talked about on five, it's just, it's really narrow. Excuse me. It's like a shallow green. It's wide and very shallow. It's only about 22 yards deep. And for that uphill second shot where you

You just don't want to be in those front bunkers. mean, they're just, if you land the ball just short of the green in the bunker, it's coming down into the flat. But if you roll it in from the trees, it'll roll just onto the upslope. That's a huge difference because they're really deep and that the bunker lips right in your mind when you're looking up there towards the green, it's all you can see because you're going uphill enough where all you can see is the bunkers and then the flag, but you can't see any green. And so you're depending on the

J Chris Lemley (34:20)
Mm-hmm.

Stewart Cink (34:34)
patrons around the green to tell you if your shot was good or if it's not good and you know exactly what happened to your ball when it landed just by the sound of the crowd's reaction.

Gregg Dewalt (34:45)
Patrons.

Stewart Cink (34:46)
I've had the patrons and I've heard it all. I've heard it all. I've been over the green, which is no good. I've been short of green, which you can see I've been close and it's a, I mean, at the risk of sounding redundant, it's a difficult green to put. It's a difficult green to read. It, that's one of the greens that kind of slopes away from the general tendency of Rays Creek.

And so you kind of having to battle your mind like, okay, Rays Creek is over there, but the slope looks like it's going this way. Most of the greens are tilted toward it and it just accentuates the break. There, they kind of fight one another.

J Chris Lemley (35:20)
Hmm. It's, it's, know, if anybody listened, it'd never been, you don't realize until you go, you step foot on the grounds, how much undulation there is on that piece of property.

Stewart Cink (35:33)
Yeah, I think the biggest example of that is probably when you, you know, step on 10T and you're looking down kind of a, it's at one of the, I don't know if 10T is the highest point, maybe number 2T is higher, but 10 and 1 and 18, that's kind of like a high point on that part of the grounds. And when you stand on 10T, looks like the 10th T is just like being swallowed up by the earth down the fairway there. I mean, it's, it falls away fast, really fast down that, down the hill there and

J Chris Lemley (35:41)
yeah.

Stewart Cink (36:03)
You lose a lot of elevation from 10 tee to 12 green in a hurry. You know, the tee shot on 10 plays, I don't even know how many yards it plays down, but at least 20, 25 yards. And you need to hit about a 30 yard hook off that tee too. So it's an unusual shot. And then the tee and the second shot on 11 probably combined for another 20, 25 yards of downhill. So you've lost close to 50 yards and you haven't even played two holes yet. And it's just like,

J Chris Lemley (36:07)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Stewart Cink (36:32)
You know, it's

very steep and there's a lot of side hills and then, you know, 18 you gain almost all that right back up because it's straight up the hill.

J Chris Lemley (36:41)
Mm-hmm.

Gregg Dewalt (36:42)
And that was

always, it was like you get to 10, okay, we're going downhill now. And then you get to 18 walking behind beside the ropes. And man, I got to walk up that hill now after watching you for 18 holes. It's changed a lot since I've covered it.

J Chris Lemley (36:49)
Back up.

Stewart Cink (36:53)
I know, back up to that media buffet. You gotta walk back up there.

It's almost worth it getting a three dollar ham and cheese on rye or a egg salad or a chicken salad sandwich out there.

Gregg Dewalt (37:07)
Yeah.

Yeah, let's talk about the how many pimento cheese sandwiches have you eaten in your career at the Masters?

Stewart Cink (37:15)
Less than five.

Ask me how many egg salads.

Gregg Dewalt (37:21)
I'm gonna say more over a hundred.

Stewart Cink (37:22)
More than 500. I

J Chris Lemley (37:24)
wow.

Stewart Cink (37:25)
love the egg salad. I'm not a pimento cheese fan, but I really just like the egg salad over there. That's about the only one I ever get. Occasionally I'll get a ham and cheese, but pretty much the egg salads for me. If I'm in the catty area or if I'm loading up a little baggie for coming home to the house to stock our own fridge, I usually put a handful of those egg salads in there.

Gregg Dewalt (37:45)
So your bag weighs more leaving the premises than it does when you get there.

Stewart Cink (37:50)
Yeah, the egg salads weigh, they definitely outweigh a dozen balls.

Gregg Dewalt (37:54)
You would fit right in the media.

J Chris Lemley (37:55)
Hahaha

Stewart Cink (37:58)
I would. Yep. One

of my most fascinating times during COVID, had, you know, they were trying to, it was not the 2021 in November. didn't play in that one, but the next year, 2021, they were trying to keep the staff as minimal as possible. And they had us in a different locker room for that year. And so the guys that were working in the locker were also sort of doing double shifts and working in the food prep.

So they would go from food prep to locker, locker to food prep. And I was talking to one of the guys in there one day and he was saying that he was in charge of mixing up the egg salad batch. And he had my attention when he said that. And he said that it was like a, I don't know how many gallons, like enormous vat of egg salad that he was making up that was like the size of a dump truck. And he was like making the ingredients fix, know, mixing up everything so they balanced out right and everything and stirred it with a big paddle.

J Chris Lemley (38:47)
god.

Stewart Cink (38:54)
Man, I would have loved to go and do that job.

J Chris Lemley (38:58)
Well, talk, talk, tell us about you. You mentioned the, the locker room. Tell us about the players locker room and kind of what that's like and sharing lockers. And do you have the same guy every year? Just, yeah, just pull the curtain back.

Stewart Cink (39:12)
Yeah,

okay. Yeah. So, um, there's two locker rooms, um, not counting the one I was just describing from 2021. That one got used that one year and it got repurposed for something else. It was a new building. That was just for 2021 that we didn't share lockers that year. Um, normal years like, like this year, I'm sure they have two lockers. Um, there's a locker room for the, well, there actually might be three. There's the champions locker room for obviously the masters winners.

There's the amateur locker room for the ones that stay in the crow's nest. I think they have their own. And then there's the locker room for the rank and file like the rest of us. And so in there, that's the main members locker room too. And

Yes. Um, I seem to, I had Mr. Evans locker a lot. Like I think that kind of became my designated locker. Nick Evans, Augusta member, I believe he's from Augusta. Nice guy. Um, I had his locker and then I would always have another player in there with me, except for occasionally I would be alone and I don't know why, but they just, there's no rhyme or reason sometimes, but, um, real, you know, easy going locker room guys, the same staff pretty much for, uh, most of my

Masters career, Richard and the boys over there. um, you know, occasionally they'll hire a newer guy to come in. Maybe they'll bring one in from another club and then, but they don't usually bring in somebody just for a little while. They usually stick. If somebody comes in, they're going to be there for awhile. So, um, there's two or three guys at any one time handling the locker room and they're kind of in charge of, uh, generally keeping things neat. You know, it's not unruly place or anything by any stretch, but

They're vacuuming the floor. They're keeping the food in the lounge. They have like a nice players only lunch in there and breakfast. They keep it stocked. They'll take your order if you want to order something and have it brought in. And obviously they're doing stuff like shoes and everything and just things that locker room staff would normally do, but they're always super nice. occasionally, you know, if you have an extra ticket or something like that, usually like let those guys have it and.

practice rounds, I would definitely do that. And I know other players do too, that's always appreciated. But the locker room for the members, it looks right out over, it looks right close to where the first tee used to be until they changed it. Now it's 30 yards back. But one of my earliest masters, I got a good story from sitting around there. I was probably about ready to go warm up. And this is before I did anything in the gym or anything like that, before I would just sit there and have breakfast and then go straight to the range.

The ceremonial first shot was being hit right outside. And you could see out this little, we're on the second floor in the locker room. You could see out over all the people. was great. So we went out and watched them all hit. I was sitting there with Davis and Davis love that is, and myself and two or three other people just sitting around the table. And Byron Nelson was one of the hitters. So after the shot, we all just kind of got back to the table and continued our breakfast and kept on schedule.

Byron Nelson comes through and walks into the locker room and he comes right over to Davis' lab because Davis and him were friends and I didn't really know Byron Nelson. And he comes over to Davis, kind of puts his hands on his shoulders and kind of like, gentlemen, how are y'all doing? And Davis said, how'd you hit it, Mr. Nelson? He said, well, I cleared the creek. And everybody's kind of like, all right, way to go. Well, have a great day. You he walked off and Davis was laughing. goes, they filled the creek in in 1955.

J Chris Lemley (42:50)
Hahaha

Stewart Cink (42:52)
This is 1998 or 9. So the creek that used to be there 47 years ago still exists in Byron Nelson's memory and he cleared it.

Gregg Dewalt (43:02)
Really.

J Chris Lemley (43:03)
He cleared it.

Stewart Cink (43:06)
So apparently there's a huge scoreboard right off the first tee on the right side. It's down in the dip. You hit your drive, you walked down and you walk up to where your balls end up. And yeah, if you look at old photos from the fifties and before, there was a creek that ran across that valley right down there front of the, across one and in front of nine. And it just kind of made its way down that little low patch. Davis said they filled that in at 55 and Byron cleared it. No one told him.

Gregg Dewalt (43:32)
Nobody's told him.

Stewart Cink (43:35)
That was cute though, mean moments like that you just don't see at other tournaments.

J Chris Lemley (43:40)
Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (43:41)
Do you always, I mean, did players walk on eggshells? are you scared of doing something not proper when you're walking to grounds or in your clubhouse or?

Stewart Cink (43:54)
Yes, a little bit, but I mean there's a mystique about the cell phones and stuff like that but you know if you're in the locker room and your phone rings You answer the phone, you know, you don't just like ignore it mean you would be discreet about it. You might walk over to the corner and just kind of talk quietly but The guys in the locker room are not gonna come over to you and say excuse me No phones, know there they might make a joke about it and that might be interpreted as hey no phones but

As long as you're reasonable about it. I would definitely not walk around outside the locker room with my phone up to my ear or taking pictures or anything, but you know, they don't really make you feel like you're on eggshells or anything like that. And maybe that's because I played in 20, maybe my first one or two, I felt that way a little bit, but there's the odd incident where someone or a player's family member might, you know, get out of line doing something like taking photos at the par three.

or something like that. that's, you know, kind of a, they might make an example out of somebody, but it's rare and everybody's respectful.

J Chris Lemley (44:59)
Speaking of the par 3, did you normally participate in that?

Stewart Cink (45:03)
Yeah, I played in it think every year except for if there was a storm or something. Yeah, I had a good time with that. kids, my dad cattyed for me in that for a little while. Then my kids alternated for about 12 years. And then we started, we let that be a part of our foundation efforts. I don't know how to say, we auctioned it off without saying we auctioned it off. But no, that was always a popular thing and we had some good

J Chris Lemley (45:07)
Mm-hmm.

Okay.

Stewart Cink (45:33)
good times with friends of ours and Matt Ryan catty forming that one year quarterback for the Falcons when he was at the peak of his career and not because the auction just because you know was he's a friend of mine but we had a good time and the par three is certainly another unique part of the tournament.

J Chris Lemley (45:50)
Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (45:52)
Did you try to win it?

Stewart Cink (45:53)
I mean, I tried to hit good shots. I tried to make holes in one and I made a couple of holes in one. So that was always fun. You know, got some crystal for that. I made one with my dad caddying early on, which was cool. We got somebody painted a picture of the moment when that ball went in and everybody's arms were up. So I've got that as a keepsake and yeah. But there's a lot of short shots, know, like number two is about 55 yards. Number three is about 65 yards.

J Chris Lemley (46:13)
That's pretty cool.

Stewart Cink (46:22)
and it plays down about 10. There's a lot of shots like that. There's funnel hole locations, you know, I mean, you see the ones on TV and it, it's fun. And you, a lot of those holes though, you got to hit nice shots. mean, the greens are tiny and they can be really hard too. So you can't just get up there and hit like a little, you know, you can't take a nap on those little teas or you'll miss the green from 55.

Gregg Dewalt (46:47)
It's a beautiful part of the property. Some people say it's the most, the best part of the property.

J Chris Lemley (46:49)
It really is, yeah.

Stewart Cink (46:49)
Ugh.

It is,

it really is. And it's so kind of like enclosed by itself, you know, that it encircles this pond, roughly anyway. And then the land around the pond also slopes down toward it. So you're kind of like in this big bowl plan and you can't see any roads, you can't see any buildings. All you have is magnolias and pines and a couple of greens and a pond and the bunkers. And it's just like, it's a piece of artwork down there. It's awesome.

J Chris Lemley (47:20)
Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (47:21)
Did you let Connor and Reagan hit a shot on the ninth hole?

Stewart Cink (47:26)
course I left them hit every time and they let the they for a long time they let people hit but then the more recent years they would stop you unless you're a celebrity I remember with one of the years that we we had the par-3 caddying in our foundation efforts I had a guy caddying for me from that and then Zach had Andy Roddick caddying for him and we've got to the tee

Andy Roddick hit a shot and then when my friend got a club out of the bag, the member who was kind of guarding the tee said, no caddies are hitting today. I was like, he just hit, he just hit. They're like, sorry, no caddies. And I'm like, all right, okay.

So if you're a celeb, if you're Andy Roddick, you're hitting. But it's a fun, I remember Connor hit the green, he hit like eight feet one time, it was pure. But yeah, you can have some, I don't think they want golf balls going in too many crazy directions. Because there's a lot of people crammed into that little area. Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (48:22)
Thank

There is.

J Chris Lemley (48:33)
Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (48:34)
What's your, merch budget down there when you go, how much stuff do you carry back to friends and stuff?

Stewart Cink (48:41)
Never, never

been, never been to the merchant merchandise. That is the sole responsibility of Lisa. She, she gets a list, but we don't really buy anything for ourselves. She gets a list of things from people and she buys it and she buys a few gifts and that's it. We're not really big on all that stuff, but the stories from people that are in there buying a lot of stuff are just unbelievable. Like people that come, maybe they know they're going to be at the masters one time.

or they live in another continent or something like that, they'll just go in there and I've heard stories of like $25,000 right on the credit card. And no questions asked, you don't walk out of there with a bag. It goes straight to either FedEx or UPS and it's just part of the deal. It's such an unbelievable operation.

Gregg Dewalt (49:33)
Yeah, we are.

J Chris Lemley (49:33)
Yeah, the numbers

that you hear that that place does during the tournament week is just, they're just crazy. And having, and having been in there, I would say, yeah, they're probably true.

Stewart Cink (49:45)
Yeah, I think they are. And you got to get there early apparently for some of the hotter items, you know, but fortunately for myself, I've got very little experience in there.

Gregg Dewalt (49:57)
the, you know, they've got the main merch place and then, but you can go, or you used to go into the clubhouse or the media could. And my first, my first year in there, I mean, I went in and bought a bucket hat and the people in front of me, they, $1,200 later, that was 1997. So that's, that's probably $5,000 now, but.

Stewart Cink (50:15)
Mm-hmm. Mm.

Yeah, yep, it's a it's quite a business and they they really steward their Business well because I mean if you see when you look at the field every year You know, they started that tournament called the well, they started the I think it's called the Asian Pacific amateur a something like that, in conjunction with RNA and the USGA in the and Augusta National they started that and they started one in South America to like the

J Chris Lemley (50:37)
that he's an amp and we're gonna go.

Stewart Cink (50:48)
Latino America, maybe it's called and the winner gets in the Masters but if you think about it like think about the broadcast rights and how valuable they are in places like China and India and Argentina and Brazil with all the population there if you got a Brazilian amateur playing in the Masters Every TV network in South America is gonna want to cover the Masters. They're gonna pay for it same thing goes for China and Japan and if you got a an Indian player who's playing in the Masters who

J Chris Lemley (50:50)
you

Stewart Cink (51:17)
got there because he won the Asia Pacific Amateur. I mean think about that business decision that is very very smart. So they do a great job kind of building their own brand around the world and that's how they do it.

J Chris Lemley (51:24)
Yes.

So Stewart, know that if you make an eagle, you get some crystal. What other things go on like that that maybe we don't know about?

Stewart Cink (51:42)
I believe there's also a low round of the day You get a little piece of crystal and it varies every year. It's not always the same I've got I didn't make a lot of Eagles. I strangely made very few Eagles maybe like five or six Eagles ever over there, maybe even less so But you do you do get some crystal and it's always different things It could be like some little highball glasses could be like a little coffee cream Thing or you know, whatever. It's just different stuff every year

They vary it up and then for the low round of the day, there's also some crystal might be, you know, something similar to that. What else is there? As far as I know, well, most people know about the green jacket being awarded for first place and a nice trophy that I think is up to you if you want to purchase the trophy or not. I learned that from Zach Johnson, who was the one he's probably my best friend out there on tour. Who's won the Masters.

You get invited back to the Masters next year automatically if you're in the top 12. I have finished one shot out of that at least twice. But I remember my last one I finished. No, not my last one. I played it in 22. When I won the British in 09, I got you in the Masters five years. So 10, 11, 12, 13, 14. In 14, I finished tied for 14th. And up until that year,

It was the top 14 to get you back in the Masters and I was so excited. And when I went into the scoring, I was in T14 and I was like, hey, T14, right? That's back in. said, oh, we switched to 12 this year. I thought maybe that's the way my Masters career was going to end. I did get in for, I got into three more after that, but I thought at that time, like, is this the way it's going to end? Please, not like this, not like this. So the top 12 gets you back in.

J Chris Lemley (53:33)
Hahaha!

Stewart Cink (53:42)
There's a little bit of an idiosyncrasy where they don't, they only have about somewhere between like 88 and 95 players usually. That's kind of their number. And they don't try, they don't put any effort into trying to make it an even number. So there's almost always an odd twosome out there. And I've been in it where you play the first day as a twosome and you tee off almost right after the ceremonial shot goes. mean, they're like, soon as they shake hands and they're out of there, they're like, on the tee. And I mean, you better be ready to go.

And then what they do is there's no first tee tenth tee flip on Thursday and Friday So the second round if you're first off in the morning in that twosome, you're in the center of the field in a twosome around like 1140 so Look for that this year in the pairings. Somebody's gonna probably be in that situation that's awkward because you got to pace yourself and if you like you're playing so slow, but two players just play so much faster than three that you feel like you're

J Chris Lemley (54:35)
Hmm.

Stewart Cink (54:41)
pacing yourself and then you get to the next hole, you know, and they're just walking off the tee. It's just an odd, odd thing for a major championship. There's really not a lot else. I mean, there's a lot of secrets that I don't know about too. There's just so much. Berkman's Place is a new thing that a lot of people know about now. It's kind of like the elevated ticket. It's like the what? 1500 a day or four grand a day or something. It's tucked over there behind number five and

J Chris Lemley (54:46)
Hmm.

Stewart Cink (55:12)
maybe to the left of 16 green and behind number five green and 60 back in there. It's kind of this private, super high end, like, like some of the best food and beverage you could get anywhere in the world. And they've got a couple of greens that they replicated from the course. They keep them at like tournament speeds so you can putt and get an experience like that. There's some caddies out there that are kind of like helping you with the breaks masters, local caddies, Augusta caddies. And then, they have the, they have a few members,

assigned to Berkman's place every year. Some of the members, think that are considered to be like more like forward facing, like public members, like Condoleezza Rice would be one of those that they're out there. Just it's a meet and greet. You know, you just, walk through the gates and hi Dr. Rice, you know, and just like you've known each other forever. From what I hear, I've never been out there, but, a few people that I've talked to has said it's pretty, it's pretty spectacular thing to get if you have a chance. then rumors are now that,

J Chris Lemley (56:02)
Okay.

Stewart Cink (56:10)
I've been hearing for a few years that Augusta National is about to build another course. They've been talking about it anyway and what their ideal hope would be is that they can move the Augusta National women's amateur on site instead of having it the other course because that's been a real big success for them. So they're going to build another course and one day Augusta National have two courses. They'll play the women's amateur on the other course.

And then the final round, guess, will be on the big tournament course. gosh, I don't know what else. I'm going to be interested to see this year if I can see what the tree situation looks like after the big storm. Everybody's heard about how many trees they lost. And some players that played it said you wouldn't believe the difference in some of the looks through the course. You can just see across the property so much more, but just not sure how much they'll be talking about that or how much television will even show it.

J Chris Lemley (56:47)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (57:08)
Will they let them talk about it?

Stewart Cink (57:10)
Yeah, that's the thing that they control pretty heavily what is talked about on TV and what kind of, you know, what words are used to describe certain things. Like there's no, there's no grandstands, there's no bleachers, there's only observation areas. There's no grain on the greens. There's only tendency. And I don't know why that is, but they've kept that very important to them for a long time.

Gregg Dewalt (57:25)
Peace.

to tour falls you visited John Daly's trailer down the street on Washington Road.

Stewart Cink (57:42)
I have visited that yes, I have it. He parks it right outside of there's a There's a chicken wing establishment that is orange That is down there along the road and daily parks his bus out there and it's like little Trailer with an awning and sells merchandise and grip it and rip it and he he does he grips it and rips it down there with the locals and the Golf fans. He's it's popular

J Chris Lemley (57:54)
Mm-hmm.

Stewart Cink (58:11)
And he's down there every week for the Masters.

Gregg Dewalt (58:14)
I've heard that the chain restaurant is filed for bankruptcy too. So, I'm not, I'm not sure what's going to happen if, if, if they close where his trailer moves to.

Stewart Cink (58:18)
yeah?

Somebody else will want to have Daley there that week because I remember being by there before and it was packed It's it's a it's a draw. So I think they'll want in there

J Chris Lemley (58:33)
It's a draw.

Gregg Dewalt (58:34)
He's a man of the people.

Stewart Cink (58:36)
He is. He's man of the people.

J Chris Lemley (58:39)
favorite place to eat in town.

Gregg Dewalt (58:39)
I'm shocked that you said

you visited that location.

Stewart Cink (58:43)
Oh yeah, I had something to do over there one time and I don't remember what it was, but I went by there.

Gregg Dewalt (58:48)
keeping with kind of a quick, quick hitters. if you show up at the front gate, say three weeks from now, will they let you in and let you play?

Stewart Cink (59:02)
They won't because I'm not a member and I'm not in the Masters. That's the only ways you can play is if you're either a member or with a member or you're in the Masters field. If you're in the Masters field, all you gotta do is call up an hour ahead and say, hey, I'm gonna come play a practice round and you're welcome. They'll let you. You can, you used to be able to play as many as you wanted to, but I think a few players may have been there a little bit much and so they limit it now to five. Five days.

J Chris Lemley (59:18)
Can you as many practice rounds?

Can you bring a guest with you?

Stewart Cink (59:32)
You can bring a guest. You cannot bring a guest to play.

J Chris Lemley (59:36)
but they can walk along with you.

Stewart Cink (59:37)
Yeah,

you can bring a guest, like you can bring a caddy. I've taken my caddies over there, you know, because they can do all the homework they need to do without any of the patrons or the stuff going on. And it's, we've had very, very valuable sessions over there. I took Reagan Lee caddyed. In fact, I don't remember playing without a trip ahead of time with my caddy, just to do that. You know, there's so much note taking and...

J Chris Lemley (59:48)
Sure.

Stewart Cink (1:00:04)
You just cannot see too many golf balls roll on those greens. know, you just, there's no way to do that too much. So, if you just went over there and did nothing but putt, that would be worth the trip. You always have to take a local caddy. They ask you to take a local caddy. And at first I thought that was kind of a dumb rule, but then over the years, I really learned that that was kind of valuable because those guys see more than anybody over there, even though the golf quality may not be super high, they still see putts roll.

they see whole locations and they see they remember all that stuff. know, so, I actually got quite a lot of good Intel off the local caddies over there and had a good time doing it.

Gregg Dewalt (1:00:45)
When how precise do your iron shots have to be at Augusta as compared to Phoenix or, you know, just.

Stewart Cink (1:00:55)
Yeah, I know

what you mean. Just because of the shape of the greens and like the subtlety of the slopes and severity, the firmness too, it's more precise. And also because there's no rough anywhere around the greens, the fairways are cut pretty tight around the greens that your ball, if it gets off the greens, will kind of carry itself away from the hole.

May surprise you, but still the number one factor in up and down percentage on for the pros is distance to the hole. So if your ball carries 20 yards away from the hole, that's a harder shot than if it sticks right on the edge in the rough, even if it's a bad lie. So that's one of the challenges is just when your ball lands, it just won't stop. the slopes and the fingers and the greens where the hole locations are can be pretty small. And you know, the

The shot on number six comes to mind when the par three with the, it's a big green, but the upper tier on the right side is a real highly elevated part of the green. That's really tiny for like a hundred and eighty five yard shot coming in. It's just almost impossible to hit the ball on that green. It's too small of an area for the percentage, you know, for your, distance of the shot. And so a lot of good shots don't hit that part of the green and end up with just crazy up and down type scenarios where.

you don't have much of a chance. Your ball just rolls a long way from that area. And that's the kind of shot you face a lot of the day is that like it's either it's do or die. And that's why you just don't ever feel comfortable.

Gregg Dewalt (1:02:38)
Chris, what you got?

J Chris Lemley (1:02:39)
I know that you would in our prep, you had said you wanted to talk about the US open and whatever. I don't know if you want to move into some of that, but.

Gregg Dewalt (1:02:50)
Are you going to try and qualify for the US Open?

Stewart Cink (1:02:53)
Yeah, I'm entered. did enter. the deadline's coming up in about three days. So, I went ahead and entered it as a, just to have it on the schedule. I may not, but, it's the Monday of a tournament on the PGA tour champions called the American family, which is a team event. So I'm going to play with David Toms this year and you know, if I'm feeling good and, it's, it happens to be in

the same town where my coach lives in Maryland. So, I kind of figured I would maybe knock out two birds, one stone and get a practice session with him and throw 36 holes at them and see what happens. But I mean, I would just love to play in the U S open again. And, know, I feel like I can definitely qualify if I play well, I can qualify. There's no question. I have no doubt. Will I, you know, that's another question, but, I got it on the calendar. So, I didn't even know where is it? Oakmont. That's an Oakmont, think. Right.

J Chris Lemley (1:03:36)
Sure.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah,

that's right. Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (1:03:50)
I think so,

Stewart Cink (1:03:52)
Yeah,

so I'd love to be there. It'll be fun.

J Chris Lemley (1:03:55)
Speaking of another course with some really hard greens.

Stewart Cink (1:03:59)
Yeah.

Yeah, this year, can't remember where the PGA is. Anybody remember?

Gregg Dewalt (1:04:06)
to Quehala.

Stewart Cink (1:04:08)
Quail Hollow, sounds right. Yeah. Yeah. So,

Gregg Dewalt (1:04:09)
I think so.

Stewart Cink (1:04:14)
Three of the four majors have some pretty intense greens this year. And the other one is the open championship, which is always intense. Not because of the same reasons that Augusta and Oakmont are,

J Chris Lemley (1:04:21)
Mm, yep.

Gregg Dewalt (1:04:25)
Are they still inviting you back?

Stewart Cink (1:04:27)
Yeah, they are. Haven't reached the end of that term yet. Elwin, speaking of the Open Championship, we just wrapped on, we shot here in Atlanta the last three days. They're putting together a film on the 2009 Open. The RNA has hired a production company and they're putting out a film. It's gonna be pretty good, I think. Really good. And they've already done a couple. They did really good ones with

J Chris Lemley (1:04:28)
Yeah.

Stewart Cink (1:04:57)
Trevino and Seve about their British opens and so they picked 2009 for the next one. It's gonna be Should be out by this year for the British they're gonna try to coincide the You know the what do call it the the debut the launch the when it's available? So, that's exciting. I had a good time with that and it's a pretty good story. I mean just

Stories within the story everybody knows the Tom Watson thing and there's a few people from North Alabama that probably remember that I want it but The Watson story a lot has mostly been told already and so this this one they're gonna kind of focus a little bit more on my side of it which I thought was awesome and We had a good time doing that.

J Chris Lemley (1:05:37)
That's great.

Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (1:05:40)
Got

a paying gig for you?

Stewart Cink (1:05:41)
No, it's not. was a full volunteer. Don't even return your receipts for dinners and stuff.

Gregg Dewalt (1:05:50)
I mean, that was obviously, I think even the people in North Alabama were a little bit divided because Watson was, you know, I mean, I'm.

Stewart Cink (1:05:57)
I think they were too. I know they were.

I think the people in my own family were probably a little bit divided.

J Chris Lemley (1:06:05)
No, no, no,

Gregg Dewalt (1:06:05)
Yeah. But I mean, that was just, that was such a momentous open.

J Chris Lemley (1:06:11)
Yeah.

Stewart Cink (1:06:11)
In fact, know, as part of the filming, I don't have it sitting right here, but as part of the filming, I got out a lot of the old pictures and some of the articles and things, and I saw some front page, some of the writings of Mr. Greg DeWalt there from that day after that. And I reread a lot of that stuff. Yeah, it's sitting right over there on the island here, because we used some of that stuff in the

Gregg Dewalt (1:06:33)
I actually have it framed on my wall.

Stewart Cink (1:06:41)
I don't know if that'll actually make it into the film because they filmed a lot of everything, you know, they were interested in all that stuff.

J Chris Lemley (1:06:48)
That's pretty cool.

Gregg Dewalt (1:06:49)
So when do I get my paycheck from this thing?

J Chris Lemley (1:06:51)
Yeah.

Stewart Cink (1:06:52)
You're

gonna get the same as me, buddy.

Gregg Dewalt (1:06:56)
No, was, and speaking of that, I was sitting in the newsroom watching at the end and we had just been bought by another company and one of the bosses comes through there and said, do you know some kid, some guy from Florence, of the British open? I'm like, yeah, I'm waiting for the call back right now.

Stewart Cink (1:07:13)
Hahaha

Yep, there was a few people that remember.

J Chris Lemley (1:07:17)
Hahaha

Gregg Dewalt (1:07:19)
But that was,

yeah, but that was awesome. Are there any courses out there that you haven't played that you want to play?

J Chris Lemley (1:07:22)
Yeah, good stuff.

Stewart Cink (1:07:29)
Yeah, for sure. There's a lot of them because most people just assume that I've played everywhere but really only play where there's tournaments because I mean I do like going on guys trips and stuff like that but come on I mean it's not realistic to do that. Band in Dunes would certainly be one. Stream Song. There's a couple places out in eastern Canada like what is it? Cape Breton? that one? Cape Breton Highlands? Is that one of those? You know Cabot? Cabot Cliffs? Yeah, those places.

Gregg Dewalt (1:07:52)
Yeah.

J Chris Lemley (1:07:57)
Damn it.

Stewart Cink (1:07:59)
I think Cabot

Cliffs is in Cape Breton Highlands, yeah, places like that. Sandhills, Nebraska, some of those places look so awesome to play and those are just off the beaten track. So never, never been to those.

J Chris Lemley (1:08:05)
Mm-hmm.

Gregg Dewalt (1:08:14)
This is great, because I've played some of those places.

Stewart Cink (1:08:16)
Well, I've heard have you all been to Bandon? So I've heard Bandon is just a must like I heard it's really awesome and it's good golf, but it's also just a really cool experience and So like I used to go back when whistling straights open it was a little before Bandon I think but when I first played whistling straights, I was telling everybody like look Pebble Beach is awesome, but you got to go see this whistling straights. This place is fantastic and it is it really is and so

J Chris Lemley (1:08:19)
I have.

Gregg Dewalt (1:08:19)
Yeah.

Stewart Cink (1:08:46)
I think Whistling Straits kind of was like a little bit of a blueprint for places like Bandon that are just not on the usual track. You know, got to really be intentional about getting there. Yeah, you do. And it made it like viable for places like Bandon and Streamsong. Those places are not easy to get to and, they're pretty awesome. And so I would love to go play some of those places and I'm sure there's tons more too.

J Chris Lemley (1:08:56)
You sure do.

Gregg Dewalt (1:09:07)
Right.

J Chris Lemley (1:09:15)
Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (1:09:15)
Yeah,

you should definitely do Nebraska. The, the sand hill.

Stewart Cink (1:09:19)
Yeah, I got a chance this

summer maybe to go to Nebraska. There's a place called, I think it's called Landman and well, Sandhills is obviously on the list, but there's another place out there too. I can't think of the name, but a friend of mine just said, Hey, we're doing this in August. And I just had a look at the calendar, but it's unlikely, fingers crossed.

J Chris Lemley (1:09:35)
Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (1:09:37)
Yeah, no, we went we did land man this past summer and then we went out to Caprock Ranch, Dismal River. Just I mean, there's a ton of driving, you know, of course, you'll you'll be on your private jet, so it won't be. But.

Stewart Cink (1:09:52)
Yeah, that's how used to travel. I wish.

J Chris Lemley (1:09:54)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Have you played Hoopy?

Stewart Cink (1:09:58)
I have played Ohupi and it was phenomenal. loved it. In fact, I'm going down there. I'm going to be watching the final round of the Masters from Ohupi this year. I get invited by a friend of mine who has an event there, who's a member. Every member at Ohupi gets an event. So his event, he invites me to it and I'm going to go play with him on the Monday and Tuesday after Augusta. It's so cool. It's so good. Yeah.

J Chris Lemley (1:10:07)
Okay.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah

and there's another one that's just kind of getting started at fall line.

Stewart Cink (1:10:31)
Never heard of that. is that down by Columbus? Columbus, Georgia? Okay, I have heard of it. Yeah, I forgot the name of it. Yep. I heard that's good too. There's a couple over there right around Augusta in Aiken. There's Tree Farm, I think it's over that way. And there's Barnwell and there's another one further out in South Carolina called Broom's Edge that's getting started. They're just like cropping up everywhere.

J Chris Lemley (1:10:33)
Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (1:10:49)
Old Barnwell.

J Chris Lemley (1:10:57)
Yeah.

Stewart Cink (1:10:58)
I don't know. But I guess so. But in that kind of golf.

J Chris Lemley (1:10:59)
Yeah.

Gregg Dewalt (1:11:00)
Golf is booming. I worry about it when

the bubble bursts. again, lot of these places you just don't go to, you got to be going there to get those. There's not a lot else around.

Stewart Cink (1:11:09)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, and I haven't been to a lot of these places, but I know like Ohupi, it charges you kind of a flat rate for a day. So it includes like, I think it includes lunch, golf, dinner, sleeping in your room, breakfast and golf.

J Chris Lemley (1:11:24)
Mm-hmm.

Stewart Cink (1:11:35)
And you just, it's a, you know, it's pretty hefty. I think it's 1300. It includes everything for a whole day. You can use as much of it or as little of it as you want. You can have as many drinks as you want or none. Same price, but you stay there for a couple of days and you know, it's predictable what it's going to cost, but it's going to cost a lot. But I think that's the way they kind of, they, uh, they, mean, other than just having a really wealthy person in charge that kind of just puts the bill, that's the way they pay for it.

J Chris Lemley (1:12:03)
Yeah, that's right.

Gregg Dewalt (1:12:06)
All right. This will be good episode next episode talking about places we need to go play or you need to go play. Since we've gotten off the master's theme.

J Chris Lemley (1:12:14)
Yeah.

Stewart Cink (1:12:16)
Well, you guys know

all about the places that I want to go play.

Gregg Dewalt (1:12:21)
You know about

J Chris Lemley (1:12:22)
Well,

Gregg Dewalt (1:12:22)
all the places that I will never get to play.

J Chris Lemley (1:12:22)
that's right.

Stewart Cink (1:12:24)
I

could probably tell you something about some of the courses that you'd like to play too. Yeah, but we can talk about that another time for sure.

J Chris Lemley (1:12:30)
It sounds

like a good, sounds like we've, we've got another episode in the works and I'm looking forward to it.

Stewart Cink (1:12:38)
I'm in.

Gregg Dewalt (1:12:38)
Will

you win down at Ohupi? I mean, are you guys the prohibited favorites?

Stewart Cink (1:12:43)
It's handicap. It's a two man match play handicap. You play four nine hole matches over two days or no, you play 27. So you play six nine hole matches. It's a match play golf course and it's two, two man teams. And, me and my partner won't win because I'm a plus six or whatever it is. And he's about a four. So we get zero strokes and we'll be playing against strokes. But

J Chris Lemley (1:12:53)
It's a match play kind of golf course.

Gregg Dewalt (1:13:10)
You gotta, you gotta get a guy that's like a 15 that plays to a seven or six.

Stewart Cink (1:13:14)
I

do, unfortunately I don't get to invite anybody. He invites me.

J Chris Lemley (1:13:18)
Hey,

why got a one more I thought of one more question Pick pick the winner for this year's Masters

Stewart Cink (1:13:26)
Okay. I, I like watching this guy Ludwig Oberg play a lot. mean, I know he's pretty easy pick. He's hard to, it's, hard to go against him, but, I just think his game fits really nice for the golf course. He doesn't curve it is the one thing, you know, he hits it real straight. and you do need to curve it on some of those holes like 10, but I just think he's just got like, he's shown that even at his young age and he's relatively inexperienced, he's just.

J Chris Lemley (1:13:32)
Yeah

Stewart Cink (1:13:58)
got what it takes to sort of hang in there to the very end of a lot of these tournaments. And I want to say too, last year he was like maybe in the top three at Augusta. He finished really high. So, uh, he'd be my guy.

J Chris Lemley (1:14:10)
Alright, well Stewart gosh, it was thank you

Gregg Dewalt (1:14:12)
Alright,

I'm headed to the online gambling site to put my 401k, which is plummeting. Alright, man.

J Chris Lemley (1:14:16)
There you go.

Stewart Cink (1:14:16)
Go find it. Yep. You can probably get real short odds on him.

J Chris Lemley (1:14:23)
Stewart, thanks again. We

enjoy it as always.

Stewart Cink (1:14:26)
You got it, guys.