The Cart Barn with Don Shirey
Welcome to this week's Cart Barn Podcast. I'm Gregg Dewalt along with Chris Lemley back again telling stories about golf in Alabama. Chris, this week, we've got a a really nice guest, John Shirey from Fort Payne. One of I'm gonna call him a legend, of golf in Alabama. And, you know, obviously, his his record that you're gonna bounce the details speaks for itself.
Gregg:So why don't you tell us a little bit about Don?
Chris:Yeah, Greg. I would agree with your assessment. Don definitely is in the legend category. I can only think of maybe a couple of people that have had a more distinguished career professionally than, than Don in from the state of Alabama. Grew up in Fort Payne, played golf at Auburn.
Chris:Won the, Alabama Open the year that he turned professional. Amassed about 50, of professional wins. Just a phenomenal career and a and a super nice guy. And I think, the listeners, there's probably a lot that have never heard the name Don Shirey. And as you and I have discussed, this is one of the reasons we started this podcast is to to just to educate the people about the game of golf in Alabama and the players from the past.
Chris:And and Don is somebody I think you're gonna enjoy listening to this week.
Gregg:Absolutely. Again, he's he's a great guy. He's a good storyteller, and I'm sure, everybody's gonna enjoy listening to Don Shirey, Fort Payne's finest on the Cart Barn. Today, we have
Chris:the privilege of speaking with Don Shirey junior, PGA professional from Fort Payne, Alabama. Don, thanks for joining us, and welcome to the Cart Barn podcast.
Don:It's quite a privilege, Chris. I I really enjoy you guys and, I appreciate the opportunity to be here.
Gregg:Don, I'd I didn't you mentioned you, work for True now, but take take us back a little bit to when you
Don:were getting started out in Fort Payne. You know, how did you get in? Did you come from a golfing family? Did you just show up and somebody handed you a stick and and you started beating it around? How how'd you get into the game?
Don:Well, my whole, life has been consumed with golf, and it started at 10 years old. No. We did not have a golfing family, and, no, we did not have a PGA professional to teach us, and, no, we didn't have an 18 hole golf course to play. So there was really nothing in the stars that aligned that said, oh, this guy's going to the tour. In fact, my my dad and his best friend decided they wanted to start playing golf.
Don:They bought themselves and their wives, 4 total sets of clubs, 2 men and 2 women, and they went to Callaway Gardens for their first trip. And, you know, there's so many holes down there. They were told that, Greenfield was good for all day. Well, they thought they were supposed to play every course there in one day, and, of course, the women completely rejected that idea as they were playing. They came back and never played again, so there was this set of women's golf clubs, in the basement.
Don:My dad needed a partner, so I went with him to play with these ladies' clubs, and I really loved his club. His clubs were nice. I mean, they were they were McGregor, tourney, persimmon woods, and really beautiful irons. And I said, dad, I I I want a set of clubs like yours. I don't want these Mary Mills Northwestern that you've got me playing with.
Don:And so Yeah. He said, well, when you can beat me, you could have them. Well, 6 months later, I had those clubs. Sure. So that's how
Gregg:I started. And Did he ever play again?
Don:Uh-oh, yeah. He play he he had to get some more, but but, yeah, that was just like throwing fuel on my fire my whole life. My dad was a coach when we were little, and so, you know, we were always taught to, you know, excel in everything we could. And, when he saw that we had a passion for a certain sport, he'd just throw fuel on that fire, and and, he he he gave us the right to play, on our local little, 9 hole golf course. It was called Desoto Country Club in Fort Wayne.
Don:It was before Tariff and Hills was even built.
Chris:Mhmm.
Don:And so that was all we had. A young man moved into town from Michigan when he was 10 years old. His name was Dana Garmony, today the world's most powerful man in golf. But Dana and I grew up there in Fort Payne, and, Dana and I made a pact that we we would hit a golf ball every day for a year, one particular year. And, the only way we knew to to be taught was to watch TV and then try to go mimic people.
Don:That's why I got this really funky motion that it was Miller Barber and Lee Trevino and Hubert Green, and I was watching it. And then Dana was watching the good looking Peterson. So, yeah, that's where my swing was developed, and he he's been literally my my mentor through, thick and thin, when I was playing good or bad. He could pick up on it really quickly, and it was because we spent all that time together. No no pros at all, and then both of us ended up in college on golf scholarships, which was, you know, quite odd coming from that background.
Don:Tarpen Hills did, get built in the I think it opened 60 1960 to 1970, something like that. We finally did have a, you know, a championship golf course to play and grew from there. I went on to Auburn. Dana played at, Columbus College, and then went on and got some hospitality degrees over at University of Alabama. So best friends for 58 years now, and he's a Bama guy and I'm a Auburn guy.
Don:Well, that works. So just tell us a
Chris:little bit about that journey from Fort Payne to to Auburn
Don:and, how maybe playing at Auburn shaped your career? Well, there's no question. That that made me who I became as far as a a player. At at Desoto Country Club, every green was just on fairway level. I mean, every green was flat, just little push ups.
Don:Every once in a while, you'd have a maybe a 12 inch rise before the putting surface. But we learned to hit these little low burning sand wedges that skipped 2 or 3 times and didn't really check. So we had that shot down if we needed it. Problem was is we never learned to hit it up in the air, and everything on the tour, everything's being built today. You gotta get your ball up in the air.
Don:And so I I don't know how I decided this, but I decided I was gonna teach myself how to hit it up in the air. And I'd literally go to the back of the driving range and get on the upslope of practice tee and put down balls with 2 and 3 irons and and and leave all my weight back and hit it straight up in the air. And I taught myself how to hit it, and in fact, I became a tremendous long iron player. My my short game never did get any better, but my my long iron and and that's where I I got better and better in Auburn. I had guys down there like Buddy Gardner and Bob Dumas and and, Bud Smith and, guys that were just tremendous players the day I got there.
Don:And, of course, I wanted to be as good as they were because I I'm as competitive as as it comes. And so I really strive to get better and better every day, practice like crazy, ended up, being fortunate enough to be on the 1st SEC golf championship team Albert ever had. The odd thing about that team is all 6 players were born, raised, and today are still in Alabama. So it's kinda cool. There's no nobody from out of the country, even out of the state, and we won the SEC.
Don:So from there, I kept moving up the the the ladder as far as what player. And my junior year, I'd moved all the way up to number 3 player behind Buddy, Gardner, and Bud Smith. And then when Buddy graduated, I leapfrogged up to number 1 played number 1, player at all over my senior year. But, Don, what was it that, you know, made golf your sport? You know, you're you say you're 10 years old and, you know, you got there and you hit it around, but at that age, you know, there's little league baseball or, you know, football is huge in Alabama.
Don:What was it about golf that, you know, became your passion? That's a great question. I was a much better basketball player in high school, had both college scholarship offers, but I'll never forget the day the decision was made to become a golfer full time. Back in that day, not only was there no 3 point circle on the floor, it was before then, I didn't have any elastic in my socks either. I love Pete Beveridge.
Don:I was a nut over him. And I went to Scottsboro, and I lit Scottsboro up for 39 points, and we got beat by 25. And I said, that's the last day I'll ever play a team sport. I decided to play golf.
Gregg:Wow. Nice. So as as you progressed, when did you kinda think that, you know, the pro game might be for you? Well,
Don:I was too dumb to know you weren't supposed to get your PGA Tour card the first time you tried. And, so Dana went with me, and I went rolling up to this, this PGA Tour qualifying tournament in fall of 1978. It was at Waterwood National in Huntsville, Texas, one of Pete Dye's first golf courses. It was so difficult. It was unbelievable.
Don:And I just breezed right through this tour school. There was like I think there was 6 or 700 people for 25 spots, and I got one. No issue. I woke up in the 1st PGA Tour event I ever saw in person. I was in it, and, I I wasn't ready.
Don:I was just I was wondering if you I went to the practice tee. I looked up. Chi Chi was hitting balls over here, and Doug Center's hitting right there, and there's a spot open. I told Dana, I'm not going in there. I'm not gonna put I don't get balls by those guys.
Don:I have been idolizing these people my whole life. And so, anyway, that 1979 season, that was back when it was still the, the rabbit tour where you had to qual you got a card just to get you to qualify on Mondays. And, that was so difficult because you you you always play a course usually that was not the tournament course on Monday. If you did qualify, you had to go Tuesday as fast as you could and play a practice round on the course that you'd never seen to play the tournament. You weren't good enough to get in Wednesday's pro am, so you just practice a little bit that day.
Don:Play Thursday Friday, miss the cut, jump on a plane to shoot across the country to the next site so you could get a practice round in for the Monday qualifying spot. So it was nuts. And, needless to say, I didn't make enough money. And that's the year I I showed Dana he wasn't gonna make any money caddying for me. And so he went back to Fort Payne and became the pro at Tariff and Hills.
Don:I went to the mini tours. There was 2 places you could play outside of the big tour. 1 was in, Phoenix on the NGA tour, and the other was the biggest one in in the world at the time down in Orlando called the Space Coast tour. And, that's where after about a year, year and a half, I just became dominant down there. I I I loved it.
Don:As a matter of fact, we played a 2 day tournament on Monday Tuesday, and, the North Florida Winter PGA Tour had a Thursday Friday event. So we played 2 rounds on Monday Tuesday, 2 rounds on Thursday Friday. No more golf. Home every night. And I was just I was rocking and rolling.
Don:I was so comfortable. I had a great career down there. Yeah. You you won about 50 times on that tour? Well, either the Space Coast tour or things like the first tournament I ever played in as a pro, I won it.
Don:It was the 1978 Alabama Open at Pine Tree. So that was the first one of those 50, and then I won the Atlanta Open over at the athletic club and the Dixie Classic up at Burning Tree in Decatur. I have about several pro tournaments outside there, but the majority, yes, was on the Space Coast tour. Good enough to to, be one of the, as they call, diamonds in the rough. Several of us got we're fortunate enough to hear a picture on the front of Golf World as the mini tour guys.
Gregg:How, how often did you pat and cross paths with Charlie Krenkel? One of
Don:my best friends in the world. Love the guy. He and his brother, they're just great people, but we literally my now, unfortunately, ex wife, and and he and his wife would hang out together all the time down in Orlando on those days where we weren't playing or, you know, having dinner together and that sort of thing.
Gregg:He, he still plays pretty well. It's 72, I think, now.
Don:We we won't start talking about age, Greg.
Gregg:Okay. I'll I'll prep. He tinkers a lot with his equipment still.
Don:Oh, hey. Hey. You've been doing that for years. I've got a putter sitting in here that I bought from him in 1980. I used it my entire career, and I was so broke when I bought it from him that I paid him $50 a week for 3 weeks in a row for this putter.
Don:Well, I know Wilson, 8802, Arnold firmer flange, putter like Crenshaw used, and and I tried to mimic him my whole life. But well, Charlie's moved on from that about a 150 times.
Gregg:I
Don:don't know. Just in the
Gregg:3 or 4 years I've been playing with him.
Chris:Hey. Heck. I've got a putter I'm using right now I bought from him.
Gregg:What what was it like on those mini tour day tour days? You know, I guess you were home most every night. I mean, they didn't travel too far from Orlando, did you?
Don:No. We had a we had a radius from Plant City, Florida over to just short of Tampa all on that I four corridor and just off of that. And we played there was probably 15 different golf courses that we played, but the reason we didn't have to play practice rounds is, you know, series after series would roll around. You just played it, you know, 3 or 4 weeks ago, so it never was a need to really play practice rounds. So that was competitive,
Gregg:was it? I mean, you know, Charlie Crank was a great player, and, I know he made his money down there.
Don:Absolutely. You know, you had guys that were dominant were guys like Larry Mowery and Dick Mast and Walt Zembriski and Ron Terry. All that that older crowd, was what I walked into. But, you know, you had Paul Azinger, Jay Don Blake, and Cal Kavecchia, and all these different players, Lehman, all all these different players have come through there, and I couldn't wait for him to come. I was just I was sitting there waiting.
Don:I've loved it.
Chris:It's okay.
Gregg:What the I mean, what what was the difference between being so successful there and translating that to to tour success? Because, you know, when you're beating Aisinger and Lehman in 2 rounds and 4
Don:rounds. The term was 2 rounds, and you'd get out of the gate fast, and I had a method of getting out of the gate really, really fast. But once it got to be 4 rounds, it was kinda like when I made a cut on the big tour, I'd take that big sigh of relief, and then Saturday's round. My Saturday's scoring average was tough. I mean, it was just tough.
Don:But then Sunday, you know, I'd I'd shot myself out of it. There was no pressure, and I my Sunday's scoring average was really good if I made a cut, but, that that was the biggest thing was prolonging excellence for 4 days instead of just
Chris:2. Mhmm. Well, what are some what are some of the memorable moments either down there on the Space Coast or or on
Don:on the on the regular tour? Oh, I've got so many stories. I I was fortunate enough to come along right behind, you know, Trevino and Nicholas and Palmer and Gary Player and that group, and then right in front of Payne Stewart and Freddie Couples and Hal Sutton. So I got to see some just unbelievable talent. I I aged out before Tiger got there, so I never was privy to that era.
Don:But, those guys, Curtis Strange and, and Fuzzy Zeller and, it was just the list goes with Sebi and Longer and all of those those names were. And Sebi and Longer and, myself and Norman, all of us were the same age. But there were some I I could the list goes on and on and on, but, this this crazy thing that I did on the mini tours and one of the reason I was so successful down there is in my head, I would Johnny Miller was my all time I I just love the way he played, what he was shooting back then, and he went in the US Open before television coverage came on. And I just I I had a picture of him on my door at my home, and, you know, I just wanted to be like Johnny as far as, you know, the golf game was concerned. And, I asked him one time.
Don:I said, Johnny, how do you shoot so low? And he was talking about taking the golf course, and, let's just say he was going out, and he thought 67 or 68 would be a good a good score. What happens if he's 5 under after 10 and he's on that number already? I said, did you get cautious? I said, no.
Don:I'd start a new game right there on that spot. So if I had 8 holes left to go, I'd go like, okay. I wanna get these I wanna get 3 of the next day. Well, what if you birdie 3 in a row? Well, now you got 5 to go.
Don:Well, I did a new game, and I started doing that right from the get go, on those 2 day tournaments so that I knew if I could get my ball under par quick enough that I could make a bogey, it'd still be under par. It relieved all the all the anxiety or or angst. I'm I'm worried about making a bogey. And so I try to get 2 under after 3 or 2 under after 4 because I knew then I could make a bogey and still be 1 under. And and that just relieved a lot of pressure and opened it up for me to just go like, okay.
Don:I'm gonna birdie every home. And I shot some really, really low scores doing that. Was was your first professional win the Alabama open?
Gregg:Yes. What was what was it like getting that check? And have
Don:you still got it? That was awesome. I'll never forget this. At Pine Tree, I'm sure you guys have played Pine Tree. So, you know, 10 t sitting right beside 8 green I mean, 18 green right there.
Don:Mhmm. And, Dana had actually teed off on 10, and I teed off on 1. Well, when I got to 10 tee, he was cutting on 18 green. And, you know, when you're young, guys would always go, you're playing. Keep playing.
Don:You know? Want to know how you and I went, well, I'm 6, and it was it was really windy. I mean, it was blowing pretty good out there. And he said, that's alright. Scores are gonna be really, really high out here today.
Don:I said, no. I'm 600. So that was coasting right on in on
Chris:that
Don:one. But that that's all part of the psyche I had. I I mean, I I look back on it and think I either didn't know how good I was or was so ignorant to the fact that anything could have happened that I just swiped that out of my mind and stayed on that positive track and just birdie, birdie, birdie. I I mean, that's all I was thinking about is how close can I hit this? And, Dana used to always say, I've never seen anybody that hit it in there and took advantage of good shots more than you did.
Don:So whether it was a 2 iron or or a 8 iron, you know, if I hit it in there, I'm thinking I'm not gonna miss this. And I had that Charlie crinkle putter, so I couldn't miss it.
Chris:There you go. That's a a great mentality. You know, you're talking about Miller. We had we had Sam Farlow on on the program and he played in the open at at Oakmont. And he said, I can't he said, I couldn't see 63 on that golf course with the equipment we were playing and what how it was playing back then.
Don:Yeah. Well, we the Farlow's another great example of a really great player that got to see some good stuff. And, I mean, like, the 59 in Colonial. There was no 59 in Colonial in Memphis back then. Holy cow.
Don:That was amazing round of golf. Godburger just took it so deep there. It was ridiculous. But, you know, it's just that same mind track when you when you get oblivious to what could happen and and and and get thinking, I'm here's what I'm gonna make happen. Sometimes those rounds just get to roll, and you can't get off the roll.
Don:Right.
Gregg:You know, I think I I think Bryson DeChambeau said, you know, he he would move up to the front tees to where he could learn to shoot low numbers, and it it didn't you know, it wasn't a thing to be 5, 6, 7 under. Right.
Don:A lot of people get scared when they get there. I mean, they they start thinking, oh my gosh. I'm gonna shoot 69, or I'm gonna shoot 68. And and and I worked with a sports psychologist in 1980 7, and that was one thing that that he he asked me right I thought it was a trick question. It was the first thing he said to me when I walked in.
Don:Don, when does the correct the correct way to hit any golf shot ever change? And I went, okay. Now what is it? What's this? This is some kind of trick question.
Don:I said, well, never. He says, if you can if you can acknowledge that and implement that, we don't need to talk anymore. Because what we do is we get to, let's just say, a short par 5 that's downwind, and you know everybody's making birdie there. And you hit it in the right rough, and it's buried in the rough, and you can't get to the green, then you knock it out, knock it on the green, and and make par. You're going to the next hole going like, oh my gosh.
Don:I'll let that those are our product thoughts. And he said, what you want is process thoughts because the there's only one correct way to to make a, you know, a 12 inch putt. There's only one correct way to hit a 250 yard drive back then with persimmon woods. That was a big one.
Chris:And and and and a lot of wild ball.
Don:Yeah. What what we do is we start to get those thoughts in our mind instead of the process of the next shot. And, you know, it's just detrimental to a round of golf. And those guys he said Nicholas was the best ever because Nicholas could come off of a a bad hole and and get right back on track, but he he could only do 12, 13, 14 holes. So if the best in the world is doing it that much, I mean, I need to get better than 5 or 6 or 7 holes.
Chris:Wow. Well, you you said that you were you started working with him in 87 or 88? Right in that era. Yeah. Yeah.
Chris:And and, I think 89 was your best year on the PGA Tour.
Don:It was. It was. I fished the top 125 money winners. And if this, short game guru that I don't like anymore named Stan Utley hadn't birdied the last two holes on me, I'd have won that tournament. I finished third of the day.
Don:It was the problem at classic. It was one of the events that was opposite the British Open. You have one opposite the Masters, one opposite the British Open. And, Utley and I were paired together with John Daly. We came down the stretch, and, of course, I birdied those 2 holes also.
Don:I just like the way I tell the story that he birdied the last 2 to beat me. But, I actually birdied 4 of the last 6 and never could catch him. That was a whole story.
Gregg:Wow. Yeah. What what was it like playing with
Don:Daley in that time? I don't know who all might hear this, but I'll just leave it with the fact. He he took a lot of chances he probably shouldn't have taken.
Gregg:It worked out though most of the time, some of the time. Some of
Don:the time, it it certainly did. I mean, you can overpower some of them, but wow. Yeah. Did did the club sound different coming off his club? There were several players that the ball sounded different coming off the club.
Don:My favorite was Nick Price. Oh my goodness. He he it just sounded like a Jim Rice home run every time he he hit it. Just compressing the ball great. I mean, just a great sound.
Don:But some of the best ball strikers I ever played with, Trevino, of course, Bill Rogers, JC Snead was unbelievable. Doctor Gilmore and Larry Nelson, I mean, those guys were some of the best ball strikers I've I've played with. So impressed with them and what they could do with the golf ball, especially now looking back at the equipment we had then. That's a great point too. Wow.
Don:Yeah. It it it you know, the the winning score in today's world has just begun in the last 2 or 3 years to get ridiculously low. But for 25 or 30 years, the winning score is about the same every tournament no matter what what, clubs were being used. You know, 15 under here, 21 under there, that same win in score. And and then you look back and you go, like, how in the world did we shoot that?
Don:My my best round ever on the PGA Tour, I still go, like, I don't. I've got the set of clubs here with me that, that that I played with in that in that tournament, and I made 9 pars and 9 birdies on national TV right at the Disney World shot 63. And I look at that stuff. The driver is so flat faced. It has zero rolling bulge on it.
Don:I'm going like, I couldn't even get that off the ground. See, this high, I couldn't get it off the ground. So it it's it's just amazing to me some of the scores that were shot back then with that kind of equipment. I I think too. And and you look at the the condition, the agronomy is so much better today that, you know, you look back at those old Shell wonderful world of golf matches,
Gregg:you know, from the 70. I mean, they're the greens must have been stumping at, like, 6 or 7 and What? You know, the the lies weren't proved. The bunkers weren't pristine. With with
Don:grain with unbelievable grain pointed at you like the claw all bouncing across there. Yeah. It's just amazing to me. But I don't know how
Gregg:they miss putts today. You know? I mean simple shit. I mean, they
Don:Yeah. They just tap everything down. I mean, a spike mark used to be our worst enemy out there. You know? But, anyway, that's, that was a lot
Chris:of fun. Well, what do you think? 2 I guess, 2 questions I've got. 1 is what with 89 being your best year, what made that happen? What was it that you're doing?
Don:I was always a really, really outstanding iron player, especially long iron player. And, Hal Sutton and I had a had a a little side bet on who would finish the highest in greens in regulation, and and I inched him out by 1 one hundredth of the point. But that was my forte, and what I had done is I my dad wasn't a great player, but he he'd make a comment. He'd be hitting it all over the lot and get in the woods, and there'd be a gap this wide between 2 trees. And he'd go, hey, son.
Don:Keep an eye on this. I'm just gonna punch it out. And I'll I kept hearing that. I'd go like, how does he think after hitting this ball? All kinds of different ways that he could punch this out and inevitably would punch it right out.
Don:And I thought, well, why what if I took my full swing and just said, okay. I'm never going to hit more than 75, 80% of any club in my bag. When it got to 80%, I would hit a a soft next club up instead of going hard at this club. And that was the trigger for me that that completely changed my greens in regulation. I I started hitting well, also, Square Grooves came out then too.
Don:That was a huge help. But that's what I would do if I if I got to, like back then, our our yardages were completely different. I mean, the 9 iron back then would would go a pitching wedge would hardly ever go more than a 125 yards. You know, pitching wedge had, probably 50 degrees off, 51 degrees off back then. Now they're 46 and going a 180.
Don:Anyway anyway, you know, once you get to, like, 120, 120, all of a sudden, it's a little 9 iron. And you get to the top of the 9 iron, it is 135. So at about 132, you'd go like, okay. I need to take the 8 iron out. And so, I had something I used to say.
Don:I I was fortunate enough to run into Rocco Mediate the other day. He says, shower, I haven't seen you forever, but I use the term you use all the time. It's it's a little bit too much for this podcast, but it's not it's not ugly. It's just too much for the podcast. It was a feminine let's just say it was a feminine 8 iron instead of a full bore 9 iron or something.
Chris:Yeah. That's the That's the opposite of the way it seems that golf is being played on the tour today. 100%.
Don:Hit hard as you can now. Yeah. Sweet spots are this big. Clubheads are that big. Hit it hard as you can and and go get it, and then hit the next one hard as you can.
Don:It's it's crazy that you ever hear today that we heard all the time when we were kids? You're over swinging. Yeah. You're over swinging. That's you're swinging too hard.
Don:You never hear that today.
Gregg:No. Just, to to put it in perspective, we had, Tyler Watts on, or he'll be on, this week's podcast. His stock 6 iron is now 200 yards. That's unbelievable. 170, 175
Don:is as far as I ever hit a 6 iron. He's 16 years old, weighs a £130. Right? Hey. But but the day he picked up a golf club, his daddy told him hit it hard as he can.
Don:K. So it's just you know, it's the way that's now. Hey. Hit it hard as you can. We'll straighten it up later.
Don:And it that's pretty profound. Well, you know, as as as I'm thinking back, that was kind
Chris:of what and he was ahead of his time, obviously, that Nicholas and Grout worked on. It was hit it hard, and we'll we'll get the accuracy part later. Right. Right.
Don:Well, it's it's amazing how how equipment has changed because I'm probably the same length I was when I was on tour at 33 years old as I am today at 68 years old. It's the equipment's unbelievable, and the ball's unbelievable. And, you know, all of that stuff has has happened, but, you know, I'm still kinda partial to those guys I played with that really knew how to work the ball. And and and I've got so many stories about, you know, guys on the tour and, you know, attitudes and personalities, and it's just so fun to think about that stuff.
Gregg:Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, you didn't have an entourage out there with you, did you?
Don:No. Not me, but some of the people I played with did.
Gregg:I think, you know, going back to the equipment, I would love to for the PGA Tour to have a tournament with throwback seventies equipment. Just one week, let those guys, try and see because I've seen some videos like on the DP World Tour. Those guys hitting drivers from the sixties, from the seventies, from the eighties, and they're they're amazed that the ball goes nowhere and how far it curves offline. Yeah. You catch 1 on the tow, a 1954 Wilson persimmon headed driver just
Don:a little bit, that baby's going way right. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Wow.
Don:So what, what all are you into now with Troon? Well, post my playing career, I'll tell you one more story real quick before we move on to that that that then let you know about equipment. So I was fortunate enough in 1990 on, Saturday. I was playing really well at the Western Open, and we were still, at Butler National at the time, one of my favorite courses ever. And that's where Lee Trevino got struck by lightning, And, that's also where he came up the last hole holding up a one iron and said, even God can't get get a one tire and and, to prevent getting struck a second time.
Don:But on Saturday night, I looked up there. We were in twosomes at the time. It was Don Shire and Lee Trevino. And I'm going like, oh my gosh. And I I told my caddy, I said, look.
Don:He's 51 or 2 now, and and I'm in my prime, and and everybody up here loves him. He's very affectionate toward him over what's happened here. They we're both in the top ten going into Sunday's round, and, there there's gonna be a mass mob following here. And we're gonna have to be really, really careful because we'll hit it past him, and then he'll hit, and all these people start moving. It'll look like a lot of ants back there behind the green.
Don:We got to be really, really patient. So the next day we get out there on a hole about number 7. My caddy says, hey, boss. When is that we're gonna be hitting it past him? It's,
Chris:that's a good one.
Don:Yeah. I'm so and I've just got a zillion of those, but equipment didn't mean anything nor did age at that point in time. Wow. Yeah. As my as my career I I always say plateaued.
Don:It really knows that. People say, why did you retire from golf? I said, nobody retires from golf. They tell you to go home. You haven't made enough money.
Don:See you by. So, I'm with 3 other guys who bought a golf course in Rome, Georgia. I don't know why we did that, but, we did. I ran it as an owner operator for about 6 years. I got upset with a partner and and decided to sell my car.
Don:I literally was going through a divorce at the same time, unfortunately, and and, Dana had since 1990, so this would have been 2,000 right at 2,000. Dana had been billed at Troon for 90 since 1990, so already had 10 years. And he called me, he says, hey, dude. I know you're going through a tough time, but we don't have anybody that has owned their own golf course as one of our general managers. I can get you a job as a GM with Trent.
Don:And I said, well, that's great. I'd love to do that, because I literally didn't have anything, you know, planned or or any opportunities. And so I got the he said, I'll get you an interview. That's the best I'll do. And, I interviewed and, got the job.
Don:They said, yeah. We don't have anybody that would have known that much about running a club, especially out of their own pocket. And so I went out to Scottsdale to learn kinda their end of day closing and how they, do their accounting and all that stuff thinking I was going back to take over a club because they already had our mission statement on their website, at a place called Canyon Canyon Ridge, which is now Macklemore. Yeah. And so and so I went out and and was out there for about 2 weeks, and they came in and said, hey.
Don:We don't know what we're gonna do with you. That development got put on hold. And so it was still being built. The first 18 holes was being built at the time. And so, a week later, they came in and said, hey.
Don:Look. We've got this place up in Sun Valley, Idaho. And I went, Iowa? Where's Ida? I don't even know where that is.
Don:I've never been in the northwest at all, Harlan. And, they said, go get your arms around this place for 3 months, and then we're gonna close it and go through a huge renovation for 2 years, and then we'll send you somewhere else. And that was my Gilligan's Island trip because I went up there for 3 months. I was there for eight and a half years. Oh, I love the place.
Don:I it was unbelievable, and, it was called Elkhorn Golf Club. It's now owned by the Sun Valley Resort. But, it was my first stint, with training as a GM. And since then, I'd I'd gone over and helped in Bend, Oregon, and Arizona. I ended up I'd I'd asked him to send me somewhere in the south, so he sent me to Puerto Rico.
Don:I said, that's too far south. Went from Puerto Rico back up to Arkansas and Tennessee. And then of all things, we got the contract, in 2014 at Pine Tree. I was named the GM back at Pine Tree in Birmingham. Was there only for 7 months, and Troon then purchased Honors Golf Management, Bob Barrett's company that was there in Birmingham.
Don:And, I was promoted out of the field and into the corporate office. And, today, I'm the vice president of business development, so I go out and I I sell contracts as they come up and, you know, I lead them from their initial inquiry through the contract phase and then hand it off to an operator. And that's that's what I've been doing with Trim for the last 10 years. So,
Gregg:essentially, Dana worked for you and now you work for Dana? That's that's one way to put it.
Chris:Wow. That's
Don:And very accurate way to put it. Yeah.
Gregg:I'm assuming you're making more working for
Don:him than he made working for you. That that would not even be, an understatement of all that stuff.
Gregg:Do you like obviously, you like the corporate aspect of it, but what what kind of, you know, have you learned in along the way, about the business?
Don:Well, unlike this podcast, it's way better if you'll shut your mouth and listen than than to talk like I talk. And so I had to learn that real quickly. A guy told me, Bob Bob Barrett told me 2 things. Don't lead with your chin, and if you'll listen, a man will tell you everything you wanna know. And so I've learned that.
Don:I'm deeply, in debt for all of his, his counsel and mentorship, to help me along the way because he's a great, great guy. I literally was in Birmingham the last 10 years in July. Bob and his partner had a condo down at Peninsula Golf and Racquet Club, and they were getting ready to put it on the market. I said, no. No.
Don:No. I think I want it. So I live down here now on the first hole at the Marsh Course at Peninsula Golf and Racquet Club.
Chris:Okay. Yeah. How much
Gregg:do you get out and play these days?
Don:I don't play much. I hit a ton of I've always loved to hit balls, and and I why I became a great ball striker was the fact that I I could stand on the range. If you give me good turf and some good golf balls, I I can stand there for hours and hours. I love hit balls. I I I don't have the patience I used to to go out and spend 4 and a half or 5 hours waiting on people to get out of the way.
Don:But but I still love the game, and I still love to compete and and add up my score. I just I, you know, I've got I probably had ADD my whole life. I just don't know it.
Gregg:We need to set up a grudge match with you and Charlie. At some point somewhere, a a loser a loser comes back to to Coleman or something match.
Don:Yeah. Is that where you are you in Coleman, Greg? I'm in Florence. Florence. Okay.
Gregg:Yeah. I did we I play a lot with Charlie.
Don:Yeah.
Gregg:He and a couple other guys, we we play. I think I've hooked let's on to Charlie because he knows everywhere in the in the state to eat, all these little dive dive diners, and, he got he finds us free golfs a lot. So I guess little pros don't like to pay greens fees. I don't know.
Don:Now that that is kinda tough to deal with.
Chris:Yeah. That's funny. Well, what, having having so much experience in playing the tour and playing with so many names that everybody that plays golf has heard of, certainly the older guys like us. What advice would you give young golfers who, dream about making a living on the tour or playing professionally?
Don:Well, I I like to say this when somebody says what does it take? I say, you know, you you need to be able to beat everybody you know and everybody you hadn't met yet in order to go on the tour Because it's a it's a hard life. And, I mean, you know, back when we were playing, and Dana talks about it all the time and how top heavy you know, they'd have a top heavy first prize, which would entice people to put up way to put up our own money to to play like that. And that that created a lot of really good players because if you're paying out of your own pocket to enter and, you know, you gotta perform, then it it it is a pretty big motivator. But, it the difference between a great player at home and a great tour player is that, okay.
Don:Let's take a young man that can shoot, you know, those kind of scores that would compete on the tour, 65, 6, 7, and they do that regularly at home. What what I'd like to know is can you go to a town you've never been to, sleep in a bed you've never slept in, eat food that's new to you, play a course you've never seen, and still play like you're at home? That's a tour player. I e, the the term itself, touring professional means that you're touring, but you're playing just like you're at home, and you're that comfortable. And if if people see you shooting 65, 67 at home, but when you take a trip over to Destin and play a golf course that you haven't played in a long time, you're shooting 75, 67, That that's a telltale sign right there that that something may need to be worked on or, you need to get your name in the, employment pool out there.
Don:Yeah. And nothing against,
Chris:and I'll use this because for where you're from, but nothing against Terrapin Hills. But Terrapin Hills is not the west course and or, you know, so it's also kind of the place that you're playing. There's some some golf courses that there's some guys that that can shoot then shoot 62, 63, 64, but you take them somewhere else and they can't.
Don:Well, I'll just tell you this. In 1983 1983, I think it was yeah. I know it was July. I don't remember the exact date. Either 17th or 27th.
Don:I'm just looking at it in my head. There was 3 guys, a pro and 2 other players that I said, okay. I'll go out, and I'm gonna play your best call. And I got this from Charlie Krenkel. Gave him Hogan as a partner.
Don:Well, Hogan hit every green in regulation, but he couldn't
Chris:make it.
Don:He putted every green, so Hogan was par. So I played these 3 guys' best ball. Gave him par as a partner. And after 13, I had them closed out. I spun a 59 on them at Tarpen Hill.
Don:And and so and so you know, you're absolutely right. Because you get going up there, you can just shoot so low. It's unbelievable. But that in and of itself doesn't make you a tour player. And I had to realize that.
Don:That was 1983. I hadn't won anything. I just started winning on the on the mini tours in 82 and 3. And, you know, to to shoot and and I hate that that kids will get that in their head that that's all it that's gonna take. They've gotta get out and get road tested before they, start asking for sponsorships and people to put up money for them to go out and pursue that.
Don:It's a
Gregg:it's a tough year. Just, going back to to the mini tour, what would the camaraderie was there was there a camaraderie among all of you guys, or was it, you just showed up and you didn't like any of them? Yeah. I'm gonna beat your brains out today.
Don:There was a group of people that had had some success there, Charlie, and, you know, guys like that that you'd gravitate toward. And they they had some pro pros down there, and you hook up with certain people. Mitch Adcock was one of my best buddies down there, and Mhmm. Between Mitch and Aizinger and I, we've won a bunch of the Pro Pros. So we'd hang out together, sometimes do, Thanksgiving dinner together.
Don:Russ Cochran was down there too with his wife, Jackie, and and, we just had a blast together all of us, you know, because we were all aspiring to go to the big tour. But once I started winning I mean, this this honest truth. I'd go to the tour school after 1983. I didn't care whether I made it or not. I was so comfortable being home every night there in Orlando.
Don:I bought a house, and, I I just loved it. So I developed a group of friends outside even the the mini tours themselves and the within the community. So it was so comfortable, and I loved that until my my wife said that our kids would never go to school in Florida. And I went, uh-oh. Well, how am I gonna play golf in Orlando and kids not go to school?
Don:So moved back to Rome, Georgia, built a home there, just breezed through the tour school in the fall of 86, and went back out on the big tour, 87, 88, 89, 90, summer, 91. One event 92, and then I was
Gregg:yeah. How was it? Oh, did it take you a while to get accepted on on the tour and and form those relationships? Or
Don:Yeah. Absolutely. You know, out there, it's kinda like it's nearly like, the guys are going like, well, I don't wanna befriend this guy and then him lose his car to me never see him again. It was kinda like once you started to prove that that you were, you know, gonna be somewhere in the hunt on the weekend, more and more people gravitate to you because you were playing with some different people also, that that were making those cuts regularly. So that that camaraderie started to happen, just naturally by because you were playing with more and more of of the same people on the weekends.
Chris:Mhmm. Not to change gears too much, but, you know, the genesis behind starting this podcast was just telling stories like what you're telling. And and, you know, Don, there's I think there's so many really good players that have come out of of the state of Alabama that have and some some played professionally for a little while and some never did, but just telling these stories. And and, was there anybody from the state of Alabama that you kind of watched as you were growing up and kinda coming into your own that, and maybe a story about the about them customer.
Don:Yeah. The the the one person that motivated me more than anybody else, of course, was Buddy Gardner. When I when I got to Auburn as a freshman, he was a sophomore, and and he just did things. I I couldn't fathom. I mean, he made more birdies than I've ever seen, usually on less slate.
Don:I didn't say that out loud. He's he's a dear friend of mine, and and, thank God he he he's Christian now and living for the Lord and member Church of Highlands. I just love the guy, but he and I have got all kinds of stories to tell. I mean, he's just we were at Auburn together, and I I've just I've idolized his game. Mhmm.
Chris:We've had him on the podcast, and, oh, he's, he's got he definitely has some good stories. His his episode is coming up pretty soon, so, we'll be sure to let you know when you get to it.
Don:I wanna watch that for sure. Before I moved, he and I went to Church of the Hollis there at Grand Central and sat together every morning with Smiley Kaufman's dad, Jeff, right there, right on the 2nd row, and it was always, I'd I'd say something, and they go, you and Buddy are going to church? Yeah. That's pretty cool. That's that's cool.
Don:I won't admit. Oh, that's great. So I don't know how much time we got, but I do wanna tell you my most embarrassing story. Please. Yeah.
Don:Most most people, that have ever asked me to say anything know about this story. But, in 1979, Dana's for me, and and we're qualifying in New Orleans at a at a golf course. I don't think it's still there anymore. It's called Lakewood Country Club. It's where we play in the USF and G.
Don:It was before we ever moved over to, to Nicholas's, course over there. But, the the 7th hole was a long par 4 that went straight. The 8th hole went parallel to it just to the right of it, and 9 was like an extension on number 7. So you had 3 holes in a row that that all went the same way, and you people could stand and watch the second shots on 7, the entire hole on 8, and the t shot on 9. And, the the 8th hole is par 3, this little par 3, and I birdied 8 for my name to go on the leaderboard for the first time ever.
Don:I can't even begin to tell you how fired up I was. And I'm thinking, like, I won't birdie every hole because, you know, I've got that mindset of all these birdies. So I birdie 8, and I've got my yardage book, and I'm into my yardage book. I'm playing with Peter Jacobs and then a guy from Arizona named, Lee Michael. And, I left that 8th green so into my yardage, and I'm I'm gonna hit this fall on 9 so close I can't miss it.
Don:We call that idiot proof, but I'm into this club thinking, I'm gonna hit this close. And all of a sudden, I hear my name, Shireh. Shireh. I'm going for it. And, what I had done is I left 8 green.
Don:Everybody in the group went back to 9 t, and I'm in the middle of 9 fairway about 250 yards off the tee, and I forgot to tee off. I had to tee off. I'm looking for my ball in the. As I hear my name, I forgot to tee off. Now I'm gonna tell you something.
Don:If if if as young men, we were in a club, and I'd gone over to ask a girl to dance and she had denied me that walk back to you 2 guys. Hells in comparison to that walk I made from 9 Fairway all the way back to. And Jacob's just laying on the ground, dying, laughing. He can't even believe it. But when we left, our backs were to each other.
Don:By the time they got back to 7, I was way down the fairway. Oh, now tell us about how you hit your tee shot after that. Well, I did par that hole, and then I think I shot 42 or something on the back nine. I was so perturbed. But but to this day, if I see Peter, he'll go.
Chris:Oh, that's funny.
Don:He's already. That is
Gregg:that is awesome. So did, you mentioned Butler Nationals, one of your favorite courses.
Don:Did you have, any others that stood out? Anything that Pete Dodd built, I liked because you could shoot 67 or 8 back in the day before the new equipment. You could shoot 67 or 8 and pass the world, and and I liked I liked it when it was hard like that. That Waterwood National in Huntsville, Texas, I remember this vividly. Buddy had actually shot 7474, 74.
Don:74. Parr was 71, and he got the last hard, at 12 over par at that golf course. It was only 25, cards. The course record was 70 on par 71. It was very difficult, but I shot 74, 73, 70 in the 3rd round just past everybody, and I was a shoo in for a card at that point.
Don:But, yeah, I love those Pete Dye golf courses, the PGA, West, the the stadium course. I got 2. So I got a card at Waterwood National, Pete Dye, and then I got 2 cards through the qualifying term at at PGA West, the stadium course. So they were all Pete Dye golf courses when I got successfully through the the tour schedule 3 different times. Do you remember roughly how long those courses were playing back then?
Don:What was the yardage? PGA West was was bordering on 7,000 yards. I mean, it's a long golf course, especially that wooden club. I said Yeah.
Gregg:Yeah. I remember the day when 7,000 was was, like, expansive. You know? You just didn't run into those.
Don:This is Olympia Spa down in Dothan, that was the one that was the biggest golf course I ever played when I played it. And I know it was just over 7,000 yards. You couldn't get to 9 or 18 with a driver and
Chris:a 3 when they're both par fours. Well, I I understand that Buddy used to. But
Don:Well yeah. Yeah. He did. He also did some things up there at Turtle Point that most people would never try. Yeah.
Don:Last hole.
Chris:Yeah. Dry driving that one up.
Gregg:Yeah. Well, I I, I asked Stuart Sink one one time what Turtle Point how Turtle Point has stood the test of time, you know, because it's still as good today as it was in the in the seventies. And he said, those trees that I used to could hit it over on 11, cut the corner, Well, now they're, you know, 80 feet tall. So yeah. But, you know, on I think it's, 11, 12 Bubba Bubba hit, like, driver 8 iron in the in on there.
Gregg:I mean, it
Don:was just, you know Just crazy.
Chris:I I at 12, I saw him when he was playing for at Stewart's tournament, the the thing they used to do and not 12. Is it 5? The the par 5. I can't remember which hole it is now. But, anyway, there's a hole that's usually like a 5 or 6 iron for me.
Chris:I could've hit a sandwich on the green from where he hit his drive. I could've hit a sandwich. He was just chipping something. Anyway, it's just amazing how but talking about, buddy, I don't know if you've if you've caught the Elvis and Charlie episode, but they tell a couple of funny stories about Buddy. Yeah.
Chris:Oh, I've done that. At Bay Hills.
Don:I've got a bunch. I've got a bunch. When I when I came to Auburn, Anthony, you're going, god rest his soul, was our coach. And, he says, hey. I've I've got this guy because he knew I I was as innocent a little kid as as ever been, I mean, in every way possible.
Don:And they said, I've got this guy that, I'm gonna need your help. I want you to room with him one way or on the road, and it was funny.
Gregg:So did did you have more influence on him, or did he have more influence on you? I plead the same. Did did did you were there any other schools that you considered but Auburn? Or
Don:well, I would have gone I would have gone several different places. My my dad graduated at Troy Troy State. Mike Griffin was there, but and and they won the national title. So year after year, they didn't need me. They had, you know, Ricky Beck and Ronnie Mobley and, all that crew.
Don:In fact, Ronnie, Ronnie's brother lives down here and plays here at this golf course. But Ronnie in 1978, just before I turned pro, we went to, country club, Mobile Country Club and played the state amateur, and Ronnie beat me in a sudden death playoff for the championship in 78. And so I've known Ronnie a long time, and that team was really, really good. Yes, man. You know, Conrad Railing that was over in Alabama didn't even know Fort Payne existed because he never called me.
Don:But we didn't play any junior golf. I mean, we didn't know. Dana and I didn't know. I mean, we were the only 2 kids that played and, you know, other than the Alabama High School tournament that might have been held in the north part of the state, we didn't we didn't play any junior tournaments or anything like that. So we went to college.
Don:You know, we go down there and and, we're as as, you know, just completely, brand new to the whole tournament scene. What
Gregg:did you study at Auburn, if anything?
Don:The well, getting out.
Chris:But, getting out. Yeah.
Don:They it was a quarter system back then, and they required, I think it was 206 hours, and I gave them 206, graduated business administration degree specializing in marketing.
Gregg:Those that, you know, you mentioned those old Troy. I was playing at UNA when Troy was in his side, you know, and I said, we were always playing from 2nd, 3rd, 4th. Those Troy teams were just amazing under Mike Griffin.
Don:Yeah. They were really, really good.
Gregg:I'd that you know, this has been a a great Yeah. Great 57 minutes or so. We could probably stay on here about 3 hours if you would
Chris:tell the stories that you shouldn't tell. Yeah. That that yeah. That that probably be a a good thing we're cutting it down. Well, Don, thank you so much.
Chris:I really appreciate it. We've enjoyed this. This hour has flown by, and we'd love to have you back on sometime in the very near future. And, I love Greg's idea. Let's get a, we need to get a match up, get Charlie in involved and, and, and play play, play some golf and tell some stories.
Don:That that'd be fantastic. Thanks for having me. I really appreciate it. I always like to relive that. I just don't get a a a a a group that might be interested even hearing that stuff.
Gregg:I think, you know, back in late seventies, early eighties, I mean, that was may have been the golden age of golf in Alabama, really, that sets everything in motion to where it is now. K.
Don:I I totally agree with that. Totally agree.
Gregg:Again, we wanna thank Don Shirey for joining us on the Car Barn this week. Another episode that, I hope everybody enjoys hearing stories from back in the day with, one of the legends of golf in Alabama.
Chris:Yeah. Don had some really good stories and I enjoyed that podcast. And join us again next week for another episode of the Cart Barn podcast.
